Friendships form via shared context, not shared activities

530 点作者 Kortaggio将近 3 年前

37 条评论

If you've been exposed to both Western and Eastern cultures, this is probably something you've seen both sides of.I grew up in Egypt. Family was family, including extended family. You don't choose them, and you can't really distance yourself from them (you'd be crazy to try). You can to some extent choose your friends in school, but that is mostly "shared context"—they are people who probably are from your neighborhood or from the same "social class" (yes, Egypt was/is very class-ist).I live in the US. Everything is very individualistic, and even for those with families, it's very nuclear-family-oriented. Boundaries are well-respected. I'd say when friendships are formed, they're usually more around shared activities, regardless of where someone might be originally from, what their background is, etc.Very different worlds, with pros and cons in each.

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gringoDan将近 3 年前

I think this phenomenon is part of the reason it's difficult to form friendships as adults. The shared context that the article mentions requires a lot of time around your circle of people, just "hanging out". It's tough to make that time as an adult with a career, family, etc.This may be why college friendships can be so strong – often a lot of time is spent living and working around friends by default, without needing to schedule it.

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wenc将近 3 年前

The NYTimes has an article "Why it is hard to make friends over 30" that gets reposted almost every year [1]. There's a quote about friendship conditions:"As external conditions change, it becomes tougher to meet the three conditions that sociologists since the 1950s have considered crucial to making close friends: proximity; repeated, unplanned interactions; and a setting that encourages people to let their guard down and confide in each other, said Rebecca G. Adams, a professor of sociology and gerontology at the University of North Carolina at Greensboro. This is why so many people meet their lifelong friends in college, she added."But it's worthwhile noting that these conditions are simply that: conditions. Their existence do not inexorably lead to friendships. They are necessary but insufficient conditions.I've been in many situations where all 3 were present but I didn't feel a simpatico with the other person. I've taken weekend trips with people whom I never wanted to interact with again because I did not like what I saw on the trip (vulnerability can backfire -- if someone is vulnerable about how evil they are, I'm not likely to appreciate that). I don't really keep in touch with most college friends either.On the other hand, there's something that does lead to fast and lasting friendships for me: it's that indescribable feeling when someone is on the same "wavelength". It's a collocation of a bunch of things: the way they view the world (even if they are of a different political stripe), a shared sense of humor, and something you admire about them.Shared context definitely creates the conditions under which such people can be identified, but mere shared context itself cannot create resonant frequencies that are not there.[1] <a href="https://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/15/fashion/the-challenge-of-making-friends-as-an-adult.html" rel="nofollow">https://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/15/fashion/the-challenge-of-...</a>

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lapcat将近 3 年前

I found this article strange, because the author seemed to be reversing cause and effect. Isn't "shared context" — trust, loyalty, love, belonging, safety — the result of friendship rather than the cause of friendship? How can you trust and be loyal to someone you just met?"We can’t help but desperately compete in this unwinnable game of having the best collection of attributes to show off." I don't get it, because friends don't need each other to be the best person in the world at any given thing. Having things in common seems to be enough, no? Does anyone need to be "unique", a special snowflake in the world? In some sense friends are interchangeable, in that it's a total accident of circumstances which few of the billions of people on Earth you happen to hang out with. But I'm not clear on why "global uniqueness" is necessary for friendship. That seems to be an impossible standard, and it's not the basis of any friendship I've ever had."In my early attempts to make friends, I tried inviting people with shared interests to activities like sailing or grabbing brunch". I think the missing ingredient here is simply time. It's hard to become friends in just a few hours.[Edit:] "One way to create a shared context is through shared struggle. This is why many organizations implement ritualized hazing to initiate new members, but the important thing is not the hazing, it’s the sense that you are working together with your fellow humans to achieve a super-human goal."The super-human goal of getting your butt paddled by a frat boy? No, hazing is just a perverse power play, nothing more. They do hazing because they can, and get a kick out of it.

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going_ham将近 3 年前

I really can't understand the idea of friendship. Throughout my life, I never had the opportunity to foster a meaningful friendly relationship (one with trust, loyalty, support etc.) I found it to be apparent when people toss over the things I do.I have a lot of acquaintances and friends but very few close friends. Other than that, I feel like most people only talk with me when they absolutely need something. Otherwise, I am always the last person to be called on anything.> Becoming disentangled from your web of mutual commitments, shared history, and collective responsibility is to be rendered into a transaction, a slave.When author compared that having this "disentangled" social web is like being enslaved to business, I couldn't relate it. Isn't it completely normal? I don't want to idolize friendship, but everything will end eventually. I have experienced this throughout multiple phases of my life. No one of the so called friends made effort to contact me once I disappeared from social media. Only my close friends remained because I put the effort to do so. When I stopped putting effort, even these relationship got eroded (One can't clap with a single hand). This was the moment I realized that there is no such thing as friendship which author described.Life is what you give meaning to. It's nice that author is there to foster social meaning. For some reason the post felt like it's trying to create void that people without close friends are missing things from life. When I came in peace that I can't rely on any other person but myself, I found peace.Life has multiple dimensions. No one has to live in one way. It's better to find our own ways and be happy with it.PS: Just a minor opinion! Do not take it personally.

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lr4444lr将近 3 年前

This is muddled. Aristotle lays it out clearly in the Nichomachean Ethics. There are 3 basic divisions of friendship: those out of utility (i.e. quid pro quo or alliances toward a shared practical end), those out of pleasure (i.e. shared interest to a non practical end), and those out of virtue (i.e. a recognition of shared core moral value that defines your highest goals in life). He expounds upon the details of this at length, and I've found it to be pretty accurate.

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mmaunder将近 3 年前

This is bullshit. “Context” has to be the most vague and abused word in English. The article contradicts itself when they say “ One way to create a shared context is through shared struggle” which is a shared activity.Friendships are formed through shared experiences. The more intense and positive the experience and its outcome, the more durable the friendship. Simple as that. Now go make friends!

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Fricken将近 3 年前

Shared stressors are how people form deep and lasting bonds. You have to endure an ordeal with someone.The war journalist Sebastien Junger wrote a whole book that emphasizes shared stressors, after spending time embedded with troops manning forward outposts in Afghanistan, who regularly came under fire.The soldiers Junger observed there had little in common before being assigned their missions, but afterwards any one of them would not hesitate to fly across the country at a moment's notice to help out another, if it was needed.My core friend group I've known since I was a teenager, in scouts. I don't have much in common with them anymore, and most are cast to the four corners of the earth, but they're still my friends.My 'social network' of casual acquaintances have been drifting apart the last few years, and I don't really miss them, because shared context is the only thing we've ever really had going together in the first place.A year before COVID, at 42, I got back into rock climbing, and now that I've been on a few climbing trips with some of the guys from the gym, I feel like I'm on my way to forming the first real friendships I've made in decades; and the only thing that mattered ahead of time was their willingness to get out there and get into trouble with me.

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pessimizer将近 3 年前

I had this realization somewhere around turning 30. I had been a touring musician in my teens and early twenties, and those were the friendships I had. I realized at one point that I had selected friends based on the kinds of music that they liked and whether I had partied with them, and that those were dumb criteria for friends.I vowed from then on I would choose who to hang out with based on how kind, thoughtful, and trustworthy they were, and that I would stop having endless worthless conversations about bands and other products. I could just enjoy the stuff that I was into without making it into a identity. Never looked back.

ripvanwinkle将近 3 年前

I think the article is spot on about friendships forming from shared context.However, shared activities are often the precursor to shared context - so joining a swim team or a bike team or any group activity is still a good idea.Doing shared activities with some regularity is one way to build shared context and ultimately friendship.

jdkee将近 3 年前

Proximity, unplanned interactions and privacy are three key components or forming new friendships.See <a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/things-that-help-people-make-new-friends-2014-12" rel="nofollow">https://www.businessinsider.com/things-that-help-people-make...</a>

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iLoveOncall将近 3 年前

What I got out of this article is that some psychos share their wifi passwords with strangers.

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shaman1将近 3 年前

Congrats to the author, a good observation. I was just talking with one of my friends who recently became a father about how quickly new moms bond and form friendships due to the common context.But similar interests can make the bond stronger and deeper I'd argue.

civilized将近 3 年前

Shared context is necessary but I think shared perspectives and values are what ultimately matter. I have shared context with a lot of people at work but I'm only good friends with one or two.Very relatedly, my wife is my best friend, and I tend to become friends with people who are like her. (ugh, Wife Guy)

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tarr11将近 3 年前

I'm having trouble understanding what the author means by "context" in this article.It seems to mean "your location within your network of people"?

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rozim将近 3 年前

Well, a variation on this is what Nobel prize winner Bob Dylan says in Brownsville Girl, that shared suffering is important:<pre><code> "Strange how people who suffer together have stronger connections than people who are most content.” </code></pre> Maybe suffering here can be interpreted as shared challenges.

photochemsyn将近 3 年前

I've read a fair number of articles like this about 'networks of friends' and 'mutual aid and support' and I always come away feeling like this is more like a description of a network of military alliances between independent city-states in ancient Greece than what I'd consider normal, healthy friendship or familial relationships.I've seen many human relationships fall apart because people expect too much from the relationships, such as financial support or emotional support or something like that. It's really too easy for such relationships to become somewhat exploitive on one side or the other. When people cross the lines between business relationships and personal relationships, things get messy fast.

qgin将近 3 年前

On average, people need about 100 hours of interaction to feel a friendship connection.<a href="https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/0265407518761225" rel="nofollow">https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/0265407518761225</a>

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PaulHoule将近 3 年前

I think of that show My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic where the whole point is that the friends are all very different.

blacksoil将近 3 年前

Thanks for sharing this! I think your explanation really hits the nail. Reminds me of what Pope John Paul II said on a similar topic in a husband-and-wife context (book title: "Love and Responsibility"). He said that all relationship is build on "common ground" (i.e. school project, work project, etc) and this is one of the reasons why the Catholic church mandates a couple to have the willingness and openness to have children as a prerequisite to get married in the church. Children are one of the "common ground" that glue the relationship between the husband and the wife.

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gumby将近 3 年前

Adults make a lot of friends via kids, because there’s a combination of shared context and many forced interactions.

baxtr将近 3 年前

I think he's onto something. Then again, why aren't we still friends with everyone we spent a lot of time with when we were in elementary school? I fear a critical component is missing.

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hn_throwaway_99将近 3 年前

> One way to create a shared context is through shared struggle.Can't agree with this enough. Nearly all of my best friendships have been people I've met through a shared goal that required a ton of work (e.g. some intensive artistic training as a youth, early startup jobs, etc.)I always realize how lucky I am to have had some of these intense "struggles" pretty early on in my life, as I've met people who didn't have that opportunity and I realize how my network of real friendships has greatly benefited from that.

kevmo314将近 3 年前

The other property I've found notable is that friendships decay but some people refuse to accept it.For example, I have had some coworkers who have complained about how difficult it is to find new friends and meanwhile they're constantly traveling. Every time I invited them to something, they were never able to make it. Well, good coworker, it's not that it's hard to find friends, it's just that you traded it off for travels. Of course, I ended up becoming better friends with those who showed up.

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SnowHill9902将近 3 年前

Cf. propinquity: <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propinquity" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propinquity</a>

lordnacho将近 3 年前

Isn't activity just a part of context?Kick-about in the park -> simple activity, not many connections formedWeekly football team -> training, trips, club events -> more connections formedFrom my life the easiest connections are the ones where you're stuck together for a long time, eg education. You do pretty much everything together for years, you end up visiting each other's parents, you know each other's siblings, friends for life. In fact it's a reasonable test of how good friends you are with someone, whether you visited their house, know their family, know their friends, and know their CV.Work is a little bit different. People are coming and going, there's a hierarchy as well, and also people are busy and have already got a friend group. That being said there's still the "always together" element so plenty of opportunity.A more recent one is the "other parents in your kid's year". You end up hanging around your kid's friends parents a fair bit, and there's a fair chance they are similar to you. Which brings me to friend templates...Meet a few people and like the article says, you will find many have similar attributes. Often you end up meeting people who have basically had parallel lives to yourself, in two ways:- They literally have the same friends as you. I have this guy I went to school with briefly, who then turns up in all my friends' stories about what they got up to over the years, without me actually meeting him. Like a comedy show, he's just left when I arrive. I even had a random guy on an international flight tell me he was going to go see this guy, and I identified it because I knew so much about him. Anyway this is probably something that's happened to a fair few people, but they end up seeing the guy in real life and becoming friends.- They have done the same things as you, unconnected. They went to your uni, or studied what you studied. They work in your line of work. When you were kids, you had the same interests. They're from your city. These kinds of people are great seeds for relationships, but there's lots of them, and not all of them are watered.

m3kw9将近 3 年前

Always a red flag when someone says x happens because of y. In this case shared interest is just as crucial. Imagine friends who don’t have shared interests, they may not hang out as much and not develop “context”

Teletour将近 3 年前

He will not become friends with his neighbor just because they share some context.He might become friends with him if they can connect on activities they enjoy and then share more context.Talking about a hobby, doing a hobby together and later on experiences like birthday, parties, shared life Situations (birth/kids).It's hard to do more with a person if you don't have a common ground.

brailsafe将近 3 年前

Yes, but activities can be a decent jumping off point. I always suggest meeting your co-worker's friends. You'll probably not make real friends with co-workers directly, that's too dependant on the point of contact and physical proximity. But they can introduce you to other that can only become friends with chemistry.

Tade0将近 3 年前

> The problem is that we’re not actually that unique as individuals. As much as we’d like to believe in our special nature, we’re pretty much mostly similar to other human beings.I don't fully agree. Most of the population is indeed like that, but truly unique individuals do exist - I had the privilege of meeting a few.> Any skill or attribute you claim makes you unique—”I’m really funny”, “I’m good at shining shoes”, “I’m an attentive lover”—you can always find someone else better than you on that dimension.This reminds me of my friend who told me one time that he's seeing someone, so naturally I asked what she's like.He answered with a set of skills/talents like "perfect pitch" etc., to which I replied "are you dating or are you hiring her?".It's not the skills an attributes that make us unique and interesting, but what emerges from their combinations.Case in point: my SO has pretty bad eyesight, but in exchange a heightened sense of smell - I've seen her detect gas being let out of a stove during a routine checkup two floors down. She is also a kind person and a great listener.What emerges from these traits is (among other things) the ability to tell someone that they should visit a dentist without upsetting them - especially when they're yet not fully aware of their condition.

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AviationAtom将近 3 年前

> Not that WAP, this oneWhile I am impressed with his pop culture awareness, I am sad he had to note WAP meant Wireless Access Point

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zuhayeer将近 3 年前

"I love it when my friends meet each other and they also become friends. When this happens, it weaves more threads into the social fabric around me, making us all more tightly interconnected"Cannot agree more. Very satisfying to tie two distinct worlds together, creating a unique third.

jwpapi将近 3 年前

I left my hometown and travelled the world and wondered why I never got as close with any of the people I met, compared to the ones from my hometown. This is the reason why. Thanks for the article.

mgh2将近 3 年前

Going deeper: What about when shared context engender conflicts? Ex: family members, marriages, coworkers, etc.Values matter and these are hard to instill.

productceo将近 3 年前

When the writer says friendships, I believe the writer means communities, such as community of place.

apienx将近 3 年前

I prefer friendships that form via shared values.

PKop将近 3 年前

Made a comment about this on another thread [0]:"True friendship comes mostly from shared struggle. Think sports teams, military, small teams at work, even childhood friends and the experience growing up.It is hard to establish anything meaningful of a connection with casual interactions, and expecting to just "party/play hard" with people you don't really know is putting the cart before the horse. First you must work hard together.I'd suggest joining a Crossfit gym or similar. I've had great success meeting people within the context of group workouts. It has regular class schedules, and provides a way to ease into social interactions at your own pace as you'll be around the same people regularly. Often this leads to opportunities to do things together outside of the classes.Additionally, there are likely individuals with similar disinterest in the common activities you mentioned in you CS classes. Finding opportunities to work with someone on class assignments, studying or projects together would fall in the "shared struggle" category."<a href="https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28969047" rel="nofollow">https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28969047</a>

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