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Rust Editors to Replace TextMate 2 – The Agony of Despair

54 点作者 fuzzygroup将近 3 年前

22 条评论

pcr910303将近 3 年前
It&#x27;s funny to see one arguing that Rust programs will be higher quality... in the GUI space. The AreWeGUIYet[0] website shows clearly that a GUI editor written in Rust won&#x27;t cut. I&#x27;d rather argue that editors written in the platform-native language (e.g. ObjC&#x2F;Swift on macOS) will result in higher quality editors.<p>If the author is viewing this comment, I&#x27;d recommend BBEdit[1], a solid &amp; classic option. Other options might include Chime[2], a Go&#x2F;Ruby-focused native IDE, or Nova[3], a VSCode-alike native-focused editor. I&#x27;m not sure if Chime or Nova would be as stable as TextMate though.<p>[0]: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.areweguiyet.com" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.areweguiyet.com</a><p>[1]: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.barebones.com&#x2F;products&#x2F;bbedit&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.barebones.com&#x2F;products&#x2F;bbedit&#x2F;</a><p>[2]: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.chimehq.com" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.chimehq.com</a><p>[3]: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;nova.app" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;nova.app</a>
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reidrac将近 3 年前
Does it matter in which language is a text editor written in?<p>I mean, that&#x27;s not a feature of the editor, is it? There may be <i>consequences</i> derived from that, but that&#x27;s part of the features (e.g. uses a lot of memory, or it is slow, or it is hard to build from source, or whatever).<p>Unless the OP wants to hack that editor, and then <i>it may make sense</i> if they know the language.
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the__alchemist将近 3 年前
My experience with Rust codebases has been different from the Author&#x27;s. I think his or her points about why Rust <i>should</i> encourage high quality programs makes sense. In practice, most of the Rust OSS I find is poor quality, ie the article&#x27;s lament of &quot;today&#x27;s software quality crisis – crashes, bloat and more.&quot; I&#x27;m suspicious my observations are because I&#x27;m viewing select slice of Rust code; perhaps the higher quality code examples aren&#x27;t OSS, so I haven&#x27;t seen them.<p>Examples:<p>- Rust is well-suited to Embedded. There are a handful of high-quality tools (eg probe-run, defmt, SVD2Rust etc). Most of the higher level libraries, and the chat on Rust embedded communication channels are a mess. Dependency hell, poor APIs, hardware support that&#x27;s been designed to make trivial examples and never tested on practical firmware etc.<p>- Backend web dev - Several Flask analogs, but nothing that makes sense to use for a web page. Internally, dependency hell, and filled with generics and Async.<p>- Graphics programming - Churn, and low-quality results compared to C libraries eg for Vulkan. Fine <i>if you use the libraries that are thin wrappers on the C APIs</i>, but ones that try to apply a <i>Safe</i> or <i>Rusty</i> API are lower quality.<p>I don&#x27;t mean this as a disagreement to the article - Rust gives developers tools to make high quality software! The Rust project itself is superb. I&#x27;m surprised that his predictions don&#x27;t match with what we have. (yet)
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BaculumMeumEst将近 3 年前
&gt; I don&#x27;t think I&#x27;m incorrect in saying that when a piece of software written in Rust exists, it is going to be higher quality than something written in C &#x2F; Swift &#x2F; C++ &#x2F; Java.<p>I have no words.
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geenat将近 3 年前
<a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;lite-xl&#x2F;lite-xl" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;lite-xl&#x2F;lite-xl</a><p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;lapce&#x2F;lapce" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;lapce&#x2F;lapce</a><p>Are the most promising open alternatives to VSCode, Sublime that I&#x27;ve found.<p>Terminal editors tend to be non-starters for a serious development editor for me because I want more control over how I format my text. I want to mix fonts. I want to edit markdown with a preview. Emacs has been graphical mode forever.
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redrobein将近 3 年前
&gt; <i>Editing Style - Vim or Emacs</i><p>I&#x27;d like to see more editors adopt kakoune&#x27;s[1] editing model.<p>In some ways it&#x27;s more intuitive as you define the text object&#x2F;selection first and you get visual feedback for selections. Coupled with multiple selections, it lets you do stuff that&#x27;s rather tedious in vim (macros and a lot of manual moving around) more efficiently.<p>There&#x27;s Dance[2] for vscode if you want to try it without actually switching to kak.<p>[1] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;kakoune.org&#x2F;why-kakoune&#x2F;why-kakoune.html#_why_kakoune" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;kakoune.org&#x2F;why-kakoune&#x2F;why-kakoune.html#_why_kakoun...</a><p>[2] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;marketplace.visualstudio.com&#x2F;items?itemName=gregoire.dance" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;marketplace.visualstudio.com&#x2F;items?itemName=gregoire...</a>
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camgunz将近 3 年前
Reading this and warp.dev&#x27;s site [0], here&#x27;s some stuff about Bash (and maybe other shells like ksh) people might find useful:<p>It has a &quot;vi command mode&quot; you can activate with `set -o vi`. It works exactly like you&#x27;d dream.<p>You can search your history with Ctrl-r. It&#x27;s not &quot;fuzzy&quot; search, but it is &quot;anywhere in the command&quot; search<p>Vim&#x27;s (and Neovim&#x27;s) terminal let you manage the it like any other readonly buffer. You leave insert mode and you can jump around, copy, etc. as much as you like.<p>I bounced around for literally years between terminals, multiplexers, window managers, etc. Now I have `set -o vi` in my .bashrc and MacVim is my terminal (a close second is Vim in Kitty if you&#x27;re on a Mac). I&#x27;ve had zero bugs with this setup, and make all my money this way. I&#x27;m also super productive, which is fortunate as I (clearly) spend way too much time on HN haha.<p>[0]: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.warp.dev&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.warp.dev&#x2F;</a>
rayiner将近 3 年前
The best time to learn Emacs was ten years ago. The second best time is now.
js2将近 3 年前
Huh, I thought I was the last person using TextMate. It&#x27;s still the only editor I&#x27;ve found that&#x27;s powerful enough for my needs and small enough to fit into my head, that feels like a Mac app, but is extensible using all the power of Unix under the hood. I&#x27;ve been using TextMate since 1.0 when it was the darling editor of the Ruby on Rails community, though I&#x27;ve never been a Rails developer and I hardly ever edit Ruby files that aren&#x27;t Chef or Homebrew or Cocoapods DSL files. I navigate through a lot of languages and file types throughout my day. Over the course of a week, it&#x27;s not unusual for me to work on: Python, Javascript, Makefiles, YAML, C, Objective-C, C++, Groovy, Java, shell scripts, Markdown, and plain text files, with nearly 100% of those files in git repos.<p>Next to TextMate I always have one or more iTerm2 panes open in the same directory as the project I&#x27;m working on. I am fluent at switching between the terminal and TextMate during my editing sessions, often using various Unix tools (sed, awk, sort, grep, tr, git, etc) either in iTerm2 or directly via TextMate&#x27;s ability to pipe text into a process and replace it in the buffer with the output.<p>I heart TextMate. I&#x27;ve tried others:<p>- emacs - its working set is bigger than my brain. I used to use it as my primary editor, but I just don&#x27;t really grok lisp so extending and configuring it was always painful. I&#x27;d forget how to use some functionality I knew emacs was capable of and the discovery process for finding it is&#x2F;was too time consuming. It just felt like emacs demanded too much attention to itself.<p>- vi - I often use vi as an adjunct editor, but I want a proper Mac app and GUI most of the time.<p>- Sublime - too un-Mac like.<p>- VS Code - too bloated and un-Mac like.<p>- Eclipse - even more bloated and un-Mac like.<p>- JetBrains various IDEs - haven&#x27;t really given it a fair shake yet. But I want one editor I can use across all the languages I develop in. I don&#x27;t want a separate IDE for each language. I&#x27;m not sure I want an IDE at all.<p>- BBEdit - I just find something about it very klunky and its extensibility and integration with the command-line too limited. Its performance is great though and I sometimes use it for reading log files.<p>Anyway, I&#x27;ve only ever had TextMate crap out like OP describes when I paste a file into it with very long lines AND with syntax highlighting enabled. I suspect one of the syntax highlighting grammars he&#x27;s using has one or more regex patterns that&#x27;s backtracking itself to death.
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nerdponx将近 3 年前
Fun article and interesting analysis.<p>That said, why limit yourself to Rust specifically? There are plenty of other languages with &quot;fast enough&quot; implementations&#x2F;runtimes, which also promote &quot;higher quality software by default&quot; but also don&#x27;t require manual memory management.<p>Maybe the limiting factor is availability of good GUI toolkits? Or do text editors need particularly low level control over memory in order to avoid performance issues?
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majkinetor将近 3 年前
VSCode does all of the requirements that blog author wants, and much much more. I don&#x27;t understand the effort really. This looks like nothing more then hype following blog post.
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ElectronBadger将近 3 年前
Neovide[1] if it has to be Rust. SublimeText[2] otherwise.<p>[1]: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;neovide.dev" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;neovide.dev</a><p>[2]: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.sublimetext.com" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.sublimetext.com</a>
jmartin2683将近 3 年前
I’ve been using zed for a week or two and it’s pretty good. Not ready to replace vscode in my day to day work, but it’s close. Soon I hope.
skyzyx将近 3 年前
After TextMate 1.x stopped being updated in 2010-ish, I moved to Sublime Text which felt very TextMate-y, but was a much better piece of software.<p>Then, in 2020 as the pandemic began, I decided to give Visual Studio Code a try. For this experiment, I chose to use it exclusively for one full week doing real work, and finding solutions for the things that bugged me.<p>I think it’s been more than a week at this point because I’m still using it full-time. It has a full development team (instead of 1–2 developers who go back-and-forth and how active they are in maintaining the project), and the community who builds things for it is gigantic.<p>Yes, technically it’s slower than either TextMate or Sublime Text. When I run Linux virtual machines or other lower-performance systems, I use Sublime Text. But after Ogden failed to update TextMate for 4–5 years, I decided it was time to move on. I haven’t used it in over a decade.
jussij将近 3 年前
Most of the features listed seemed fairly standard for any programming editor.<p>But what surprised me was this requirement:<p>&gt; Autosave on focus lost<p>I&#x27;m not sure why any software would initiate a save that was not requested by the user. This seems to be protection for software that has a habit of crashing.<p>Is this really a good feature?
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pinewurst将近 3 年前
“Self selects the programmers willing to learn rust down to an elite handful.”<p>One could say the same of Aum Shinrikyo.
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fuzzygroup将近 3 年前
All - Thank you for your feedback; I&#x27;m still digesting. I just got access to the Zed editor and it looks awesome. Here are just the comparison tables: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;gist.github.com&#x2F;fuzzygroup&#x2F;8a5ad188e368df0796180d150eb41f67" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;gist.github.com&#x2F;fuzzygroup&#x2F;8a5ad188e368df0796180d150...</a>
dijit将近 3 年前
interesting article and one i resonate with personally.<p>But one things sticks out: the author complains about his text editor taking enormous sums of memory. I sympathise, truly, but obviously this text editor is doing something more than just displaying text that necessitates the ram consumption.<p>Maybe things are leaking like crazy, but the author <i>isn&#x27;t</i> using the built-in MacOS text editor, so I wonder what internal costs we attribute to useful tools.<p>I usually get more bent out of shape about software that I&#x27;m forced to run, like Teams, Slack and the progressively heavy Web. (with chrome as a de-facto requirement).<p>For text editing, there&#x27;s trade-offs but at least they&#x27;re <i>yours</i> to make. You can go very far with nvim (and neovide) with almost no memory consumption, but you wont get the nice UI elements.
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philliphaydon将近 3 年前
I’m learning a little bit of rust just using JetBrains Clion.
fmakunbound将近 3 年前
&gt; Self selects the programmers willing to learn rust down to an elite handful.<p>How true is that?
wly_cdgr将近 3 年前
Wow this person is almost more unlikeable than me #rare
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Shadonototra将近 3 年前
emotion prevents you from making proper choice<p>look for an EDITOR, segregation is not needed