Being recruited in the USA

I think the poster might be a little naive about the H1-B process and how unattractive it is for small companies. Make no bones about it. Its a major hassle, and if you leave it to the company it will (usually) never happen.<p>So advice for people in the same boat in the future, If it is something you really want to do, then you need to know <i>exactly</i> how the process works at every step of the way and also have a really good Lawyer that the company can talk to if they have questions. They can help you if tricky things come up (and they will if the company applying for you is small enough).<p>I advise you not to go with a lawyer from a big firm, those guys just want to see dollars ... and if your case is small and tricky they will not be interested. trust me. Try to find an individual or small firm that is responsive and knows the ins and outs of the process far better than you ... if possible ask them to tell you the trickiest situation they've helped a client with before ... that should give you some idea of how good they are. Usually they can bill you for their time spent talking the company, or their lawyer down from the ledge (this will happen), or if they handle the process then you or the company can pay their fees.<p>Lay out the process when the company asks about it (because they will usually not know), let them know that its not complex, just a pain in the ass and that you will handle most of the legwork (you're prepared to do this right?) ... some people chip in to help with the fees if they're so inclined ... this is frowned upon and I think the law has been changed to make it illegal, use that information as you want.<p>Above all, be persistent, upbeat and constantly in touch, do not think that a company is going to jump through hoops to pay $5000 to get you. And remember that some of the requests that are made of the company (like tax returns etc) might cause them to stall, so be prepared for that.<p>It will come down to how bad you want it. good luck

Sadly, the drama doesn't even end after getting your visa. Over six months ago I applied for an H1B transfer to a new job- they replied requesting a confirmation letter from every employer I've had since college saying that I am, indeed, a developer, and not some sort of fraud. My transfer is still pending, making every return journey back into the US a stressful experience.<p>This, after I've already been working in the US for two years- you would have thought they'd have asked for the letters when I applied the first time.<p>My H1B three year limit is in November of this year. I can apply to extend for another three years, but I can't wait to see what nonsense they throw my way when I try.

Wow, having someone implement a square root algorithm on the spot, that's quite a question to ask. I agree that is a terrible question because not many top developers would be able to answer it on the spot unless they had recently happened to have implemented it. It's not like it's an obvious algorithm. I could mention the existence of Carmack's root algorithm, which I don't have memorized but I do know he got from someone else, and flop around a bit.<p>It's weird there are so many companies claiming to not be able to find people but you hear about their hiring process and it's no wonder.

I'd have to agree with your point:<p>"Most of them are doable but I think they are probably missing amazing developers that may not know how to solve those problems, but they are capable of solving real-life problems (fix this bug, port this library, refactor this code...)."<p>I do believe some startups are missing out on some amazingly talented developers by making this your rubric. Some people just don't some solve puzzles well, in the same way some people don't perform stellar on tests, but does that mean they are not capable of writing great code. Not at all. I've met some stellar coders who do not solve timed puzzle or timed tests well.<p>Will someone please explain to me exactly why solving a puzzle is a indicator of potential workplace success. Do you want to hire puzzle solvers or actual developers? Should I spend my time improving my puzzle solving skills or churning out code that solves real-life problems?

This thread depresses me; I just read every comment.<p>As an American, the visa stuff makes me sad, because it tells me that the system is broken. But what really gets to me, as a newbie developer, is the interview and hiring commentary. It makes me feel like there's just no hope for somebody like me-- I don't have a CS degree and come from the world of humanities and liberal arts. The furthest I went with math in Uni was Discrete. I don't take tests well, and I'm no good with heavy duty algorithmic methodology (though I do know some of them). I don't have any formulae memorized. I tend to think of programming like I do writing: I have great grammar, punctuation, and spelling.<p>I'm afraid I would fail miserably at these gauntlet-style tests applied by big SV companies. I love technology and I love building things and what I'm doing now, but the path of achievement and improvement professionally from novice to indispensible pro often seems cloudy to me. I think our culture needs to spend more time and money on apprenticeship and helping less experienced developers reach that next rung on the ladder. I'm happy that there seems to be some movement now in that direction, with Khan Academy, Codecademy, Code Year, &#38;c.

Legally, you cannot seek employment while you're in US (B1 Visa). Hell, you're not even supposed to work and be paid while in the US. You can be reimbursed for travel, accommodation, food, etc. You can work if you're work is in agreement while you were in your country (outside US) but came to US to talk to your client, blah blah.<p>Yes, April 1 is the day H1 Applications are officially opened for filing for worker coming in from October 1. However, with the recent lack of demands, blame the US economy and a much more strict Immigration rules, you're likely to be able to apply till end of year or even more. Last year's quota was available till late November if I can remember correctly (2010's quota was available till Feb of 2011).<p>But, do not wait for April 1, get your lawyer (or the company's lawyer) to start the paperworks and be ready before April 1. That way, you're likely to know the result earlier.<p>Of course, founders (executive roles) can look at L1 for a better alternative Visa than the H1.<p>Note: Your lawyer will also advised you to leave US soil before applying for your H1 else you're complicating yourself. Translation, you're soliciting yourself (being interviewed, meeting prospective employer) and that is not allowed.

It's worth noting that the H1B is not the only type of visa that exists for hiring developers. Australians are able to use the E3, which is like a H1B but only available to Australians. Consequently it's easier to get, as long as you have a degree/work experience.

This often baffles me, as a foreigner in America (currently in a position where I occasionally hire people).<p>The American employee is probably the least protected in the West. Firing is about as simple &#38; cheap as it gets outside of an Indonesian sweatshop. Many start as contractors anyway. The upside should have been that companies would be quicker to hire. Instead sprung a weird culture of "the four hour interview" (sometimes several of these).<p>There's actually not that much you can find out about someone before hiring them: "Show me a piece of code you've written" - hopefully it's on GitHub or similar, ideally forked by some other people too - "Tell me about some design decisions you made when building this". You should also try to gauge personality, motivation, curiosity and chemistry.<p>That's about all you'll know, regardless of how convoluted your process. But fortunately you're not in France, so if it doesn't work out you can always go your separate ways.<p>When companies take too long to hire it usually indicates fear of making decisions. Interviewers are afraid to say someone's a good/bad fit. The CTO is afraid to look bad for hiring the wrong person. It's probably not going to be a fun place to work if you want to create new things.

Hey I've got a green card and I'm having major problems, not really sure why. Just today I was rejected from a job where I absolutely aced the interview process. No feedback as to why but I'm thinking there is something lost in translation. I'm from the UK, been coding C++ for over 10 years and love it, even coding in my spare time. When I meet people at interviews I get good feedback, answer 99% of the questions no problems and generally do well. Yet still, for some reason and despite the massive demand for software engineers, I'm just not getting anything. Never had this problem in the UK... but just wanted to let you know that it seems you're not alone.

I want to know what the stigma is over remoting. I know 37signals has quite a few remote engineers and they are doing quite well. There are loads of good engineers literally all over the country. But for some reason the Bay area would rather spend twice as much looking for local engineers than just hiring ones that are on the other side of the country. What gives?

Hey, 20y old programmer here. I feel like I could never pass an interview with these brain teasers.<p>Also, I've never really had an interview. And I've had some pretty good jobs, but I never got them for solving math problems.<p>Seems to me it requires a person that falls in one of these categories:<p>- having a job that includes solving math problems - I'm web/mobile - motivated enough to prepare for it (I could believe that) - I would probably do this if I wanted the job - people who are so freakishly smart they can solve it right away - This is my idea of Google engineers, but it's not me - people who have fun solving math problems - I love to see things working, so not me<p>What do you think is the best strategy to increase my chances if I ever get to do an interview like that?

I'm going through the process myself, and getting to work in the US is extremely complicated. Whenever I talk with local people (even immigrants) how hard it is to get a visa in the US nobody believes me, but sadly it's the truth. Remote workers is not the solution though, you should be able to get a visa easily for a highly specialized job.

If you want an H1-B, you need to apply to start work on October 1. We didn't even put in an application for our H1-B candidate until September and he received his H1-B in early October. Clearly just another demonstration of the USAs primitive immigration policy!<p>You also have to be very careful coming to San Francisco to look for a job and then applying for an H1-B ...theoretically that is against 'the rules' so make sure both you and your future employer are comfortable with the situation.<p>I'd say try again next summer, I'd bet you find success. The $5K for an H1-B is nothing for a great dev!

I've had similar things happen to me. The best approach is to be on top of how the visa works, the quotas, the timings and the best visa agencies a potential employer should use to get you in. Often companies assume it's going to be easy and pull out after making commitments based on that assumption (and also go silent, like in my case)<p>That said, the author seems to be quite employable, I hope someone spots him for some remote work or lets him join a branch somewhere in the EU and transfer him across on an L1 visa.

Agree. I am currently hiring in Shanghai and even though the salary my company offers is way above market average (it even surpasses the average in Singapore), but I am still having a _very_ hard time to find experienced candidates with more than 5 years of software engineering experience. No, my coding questions are straight forward and no tricks embedded. I do ask some open-ended engineering questions, just to see if a candidate can narrow down the solution space by posing assumptions.

It's been my experience that even without the visa issue, US companies tend to shy away from hiring remote talent. I am a US citizen with a solid mobile development background, and have gotten great responses from companies that have reviewed my resume, until they realize that I currently live outside the US. It seems that while the visa process may be an issue, getting over the "hurdle" of hiring remote workers still seems to be a major issue also.

Not an uncommon situation in my experience. Hiring in the valley has never been less skillful or less transparent. Even if you are not a developer and you do have many successful projects you still have to answer sometimes rediculous questions from people who really don't know any better.<p>Even professional recruiters are at a loss as to how to deal with this.

Wow, silence. So strange. Also strange about the visa. H1-B's were 'gone' this year (all were claimed fairly early), but they should have known that if they had looked into it at all. Unless you've had one before, the earliest you could start in the US is next November, but you have to be hired by April so they can apply on your behalf.

Thanks for sharing the experience. I went through the H1B visa process a number of years ago. Although it's pretty tough being treated like you did, I think you and possibly the offering company went into the arrangement without enough information. I remember that the H1B pool is relatively small (in the 10's of thousands) per year. And that well connected immigration lawyers and sponsoring companies usually exhaust that pool within the first day they are released. After that, it's virtually impossible to get a H1B. And when you if you're lucky enough to be able to wrangle a H1B, it's a pretty convoluted and costly (for the sponsoring company) application process. Good luck with the next round of H1Bs, the sponsoring company (and lawyers) need to get in quickly! You sound like a well qualified dev, and it's a shame that the US misses out on good talent because of an inadequate immigration system...

I went through a similar process twice. In my case it went rather smooth, but I am a scientist not a programmer. I made this post to summarize my experience: <a href="http://bit.ly/zMEHfr" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/zMEHfr</a>

I'm curious about the author's opinion of the puzzles he had to answer while interviewing. I know most of us in the US are used to this style of interview, so it would be interesting to hear more about Pau's experience.<p>I've been reading up about hiring and interviewing, and shockingly enough there isn't any good research I can find on effective hiring practices. I worry that asking puzzles and brain teasers is just a fad that isn't doing anything to pick out the best candidates. There's no real evidence that we're doing it right...

Worth noting that H1B is more difficult to get without a college degree (so I've been told). I have no credentials and the companies I'd like to work for don't care for them either, but unfortunately the government cares because that's their only grading system for people (it's not like they're gonna look at your GitHub profile).<p>There have been several companies in the past years that expressed their interest in hiring me but were put away by this problem. I don't blame them, I blame the system.

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Immigration is such a complicated issue – talented workers attempting to immigrate into the country, and bureaucracy getting in the way.

putting my very first comment in HN here.<p>Does anyone have any experience or know the process with transferring from F-1(ESL school) to H-1B?<p>From What I've been told the process is F-1 &#62; OPT &#62; H-1B but currently,I'm in ESL school and can't get OPT.<p>Briefly background :BSc from Thailand computer science,6 years experience with .Net full stack,Agile,Scrum,CMMI level 3,lately really into mobile app development(iOS almost 1 year) <p>I started applying for jobs by looking on the job listing site and even post my resume on craigslist. got several job interviews at the time apparently by phone which both directly from company and recruiter.<p>overall,the interview went pretty well then last question I was asked what is your currently work status I told them F-1 student visa.... nailed it...Well,never get a call back.<p>never give up I jump in every single opportunity, read every searched result to start my startup in USA (e.g. blueseed,startup visa act).<p>Went on one face-to-face job interview and finally,got a job offer as software engineer and assistant software architect they told me that they are willing to sponsor me for H-1B. They made a contact with one law firm and I got a couple forwarded emails from them which being said how the process works and how much will it cost blah..blah..blah (the company tried to show me that they were starting the process getting me a working visa).<p>the law firm asked what school are you in right now I said I'm in ESL school then they said you will get a better chance if you are not in ESL school but either graduate school or college which majoring in any field that related to the job.(software engineer).<p>This led me to my question above and I would like to know your opinion that Is there any chance for me to get a working visa in this situation? <p>Thank you.  

Fellow US citizens, we should be grateful for what we've got :P

I think there's not so much a talent shortage so much as there's a shortage of engineers who are gifted at contrived puzzle questions and willing to accept average pay for exceptional ability.

3 hours max. Lol. How about 8?<p>As far as the interview. Stupid questions asked by stupid people who can't tell a techie from their asshole. Should be a technical discussion not an interrogation. Their loss.