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Up next: a lawsuit threatening your YouTube watch queue

81 点作者 davekiss大约 2 年前

11 条评论

jedberg大约 2 年前
I think the crux of the issue here is that the recommendation algorithm isn&#x27;t built to say &quot;find ISIS material and promote it&quot;. It says &quot;find content that will generate more engagement for this user&quot;. Reddit is in a similar situation -- it promotes what other people upvote. Some submissions will be <i>removed</i> due to their specific content, but nothing is promoted because of it.<p>This is where Twitter could get into hot water -- if the code that was released is accurate, they were specifically promoting tweets by certain people and with certain content. They can&#x27;t claim &quot;it&#x27;s just the algorithm&quot; because their algorithm is intentionally biased based on the content itself.
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SllX大约 2 年前
I’m used to lower quality SCOTUS analysis getting posted here, but the first thing I wanted to note is that this site’s page design and playback widgets is actually pretty good. It’s also apparently not a news organization because I was ready to blindly throw the RSS feed into NetNewsWire and see what I thought of it by next week.<p>Second, it pretty much nails it in this paragraph:<p>&gt; A few outcomes are possible. First, the court could uphold the lower court decisions that 230 immunizes Google from liability in this case. Second, the justices could find in favor of the Gonzalez family, taking 230 immunity off the table and causing the lawsuit to move on to its next question: whether YouTube’s conduct violates specific antiterrorism laws. Last, the court could ultimately decline to rule on the question, citing clerical issues or the low likelihood Gonzalez would succeed on the antiterrorism element.<p>Those are the possibilities. I had to go back and look at my notes from a few months ago because there was a similar and related case against Twitter that had oral arguments scheduled the same day, and where I ended up coming down based off a reading of the room is that most likely Section 230 is upheld entirely in the Google case by 9-0 or 8-1 and it’s not even close; but it might still be very slightly curtailed by the outcome of the Twitter case which wasn’t a Section 230 (Communications Decency Act) case per se but a Section 2333 case under the Anti-Terrorism Act.<p>Here is the Oral Argument and transcript of Gonzalez v. Google LLC: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.supremecourt.gov&#x2F;oral_arguments&#x2F;audio&#x2F;2022&#x2F;21-1333" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.supremecourt.gov&#x2F;oral_arguments&#x2F;audio&#x2F;2022&#x2F;21-13...</a><p>And this is Twitter, Inc. v. Taamneh: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.supremecourt.gov&#x2F;oral_arguments&#x2F;audio&#x2F;2022&#x2F;21-1496" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.supremecourt.gov&#x2F;oral_arguments&#x2F;audio&#x2F;2022&#x2F;21-14...</a><p>Both are worth listening to, and if you’re going to listen to both, listen to Gonzalez v Google first as it was argued first. Oral arguments are not always or not even usually the determining factor for how a case comes out, but reading the room, I just don’t see the votes for curtailing interpretations of 230 in any significant way on the Court.
nindalf大约 2 年前
Is it just me or are a lot of software related questions going to these 9 people who “are not like the nine greatest experts on the internet”, according to Justice Kagan?<p>Although to be fair, they did really well on Oracle v Google (<a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Google_LLC_v._Oracle_America,_Inc" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Google_LLC_v._Oracle_America,_...</a>.). The questions the Justices asked were very good and the final judgement was definitely written by a clerk who understood software well.<p>It&#x27;s possible they might mess this up. I&#x27;m having a hard time imagining a site that doesn&#x27;t make a decision on what content to show. Even HN makes an editorial decision when choosing what to show on the front page. It would be absurd to hold dang accountable for that.
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zer0x4d大约 2 年前
It&#x27;s not far fetched to argue that content recommendation algorithms are protected under 230, but I do recall Twitter sidebar during the 2020 elections featured original commentary under the trending tags, which definitely is speech by Twitter. Stuff like &quot;x wrongly claimed y&quot; or &quot;people are protesting z due to...&quot;
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advisedwang大约 2 年前
Recommendation systems are a large part of what is wrong with the internet and the issues that we blame on moderation.
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rdiddly大约 2 年前
Surprisingly I find myself thinking &quot;Yes, the recommendation algorithm is Google&#x27;s speech.&quot; Particularly if they claim it&#x27;s secret and proprietary. If Google claims ownership of it, they own it, not any user, i.e. it&#x27;s not user-generated content. That&#x27;s my feeling on it, which obviously doesn&#x27;t necessarily correspond to the law or to how this case eventually turns out.
jbritton大约 2 年前
I generally like the YouTube recommendation algorithm. I would hate to see it go away. On the other hand, I can foresee a recommendation algorithm that would potentially be problematic for society. It might be interesting if 3rd party pluggable recommendation algorithms were supported.
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wackget大约 2 年前
YouTube recommendations make me incredibly sad, to the point where I start to lose hope for humanity. I know that&#x27;s a strange thing to say but bear with me.<p>My web browser blocks all cookies and therefore no matter how often I visit YouTube, it thinks I&#x27;m a brand new user. The video recommendations I see are therefore YouTube&#x27;s &quot;default&quot; set; presumably what&#x27;s trending at the time.<p>The recommended videos are, without exception, pure trash. We&#x27;re talking everything from Buzzfeed-level clickbait with blatantly Photoshopped thumbnails to the lowest-effort softcore-porn-level sensationalist crap which is mostly composed of lobotomised talking heads, mouths agog, &quot;reacting&quot; to other people&#x27;s content.<p>Quite often YouTube presents starkly contrasting recommendations, for example a video of violent combat footage right next to some kids dancing, or stuff like this elegant pairing of the sexualisation of women next to some cUtE pUpPiEs: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;i.imgur.com&#x2F;TcxhVhH.jpg" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;i.imgur.com&#x2F;TcxhVhH.jpg</a><p>It&#x27;s psychopathic.
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throwaway67743大约 2 年前
I think in this case they&#x27;re probably right - it&#x27;s not merely user posted content but they&#x27;re actively building a list of recommendations so instead of stumbling upon such content they&#x27;re pushing for viewers which IMO changes their (YouTube&#x27;s) responsibility, a curator if you will.
throwaway14356大约 2 年前
Of course, if the platforms didn&#x27;t happen, we would all have our own websites and promote a curated list of others. The www would have worked out great.
ouid大约 2 年前
This title (and the article itself) is deeply biased. Obviously &quot;platform&quot; recommendations are materially different from third party content.
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