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Paying consumer debts is basically optional in the United States

55 点作者 tpaschalis将近 2 年前

21 条评论

blcknight将近 2 年前
Sort of. I got into a rough spot after I got out of the military and I ended up defaulting on all my credit card debt. I got kicked out for being gay with no notice and had no savings. What little I had went to moving and finding a new job.<p>Only AmEx sued me (and we settled). I later sued most of the collection companies with the help of a lawyer and netted about $40K in settlements. Some had called my parents and told them they’d call the police and arrest me that day (they paid). Another called me work repeatedly and told my boss (he didn’t care other than the endless harassment).<p>It took 7 years for my credit to be clean. I still get calls from scummy bottom of the barrel collectors about debt I paid&#x2F;settled - even 20 years later. They give up easily though, statute of limitations is long past.<p>Anyway my point is it’s not optional, you can get sued. And they&#x27;ll harass you endlessly.
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orange_joe将近 2 年前
I’d love to build tools that automatically exercise your rights as a consumer against these large corporations. The simple truth is that they rely on the social norms of a society as weapons against them, whilst simultaneously breaking the codified ones.
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h2odragon将近 2 年前
Wife and I tried to start a business a couple years ago; ran onto circumstances that made it difficult, went bankrupt. We talked to all our credit card issuers about our troubles beforehand, trying to get some better option than &quot;just stop paying&quot;; they were not interested.<p>Discover actually laughed at my wife when she asked about it: &quot;you&#x27;re not even delinquent yet!&quot; We were going to be the next day, and would&#x27;ve liked to negotiate before that point. They have no systems for that nor (apparently) any ability to recognize it.<p>Their comfort zone is this system of debt collections.
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rsynnott将近 2 年前
From the linked piece:<p>&gt; Well, not all of it. I didn’t inherit the assets. She didn’t leave a will, which meant the state of Tennessee inherited her house. What I inherited was her debt.<p>Wait, is this right?! In Ireland, and I thought most common-law places, if someone dies intestate, an administrator is appointed, in practice generally the next of kin. Any assets go in the estate, the administrator pays any debts out of the estate. At the end, anything remaining goes to, generally, the person’s children (there are more rules for if there are no living kids or parents). If debt exceeds assets, then some debts are paid, the estate is closed, and that is the end of that; the creditors generally have no further recourse, and certainly no recourse against the debtor’s kids. Is this not how it works everywhere, more or less?
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rhaway84773将近 2 年前
&gt; Without addressing the politics of it, the impression among many informed people that most defaulted debt is medically-related is the result of successful advocacy work rather than being substantially based in reality.<p>Is this actually an impression informed people have? I’m the prime target for such opinions because of my issues with the U.S. healthcare system, but even I always understood the common understanding to be that most bankruptcies are caused by medical debt, and not debt defaults in general (most debt default doesn’t lead to bankruptcy, especially with credit card debt. It usually just leads to a payment plan).
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crazygringo将近 2 年前
This headline&#x2F;article is silly.<p>Yes, it&#x27;s optional in the sense that you won&#x27;t go to <i>prison</i>.<p>But if you want any chance of being able to take out a mortgage on a house, or to finance a car purchase, then it&#x27;s not very optional. Not to mention a bad credit score makes it much harder to even rent many apartments.<p>Also, lenders will sue you if you have the money. In which case it&#x27;s no longer optional either, when they win.<p>The article is about shady practices of debt collectors, but in no way does that ever make a leap to the idea that paying consumer debt is &quot;optional&quot;. If you don&#x27;t pay, it generally has real negative consequences. It&#x27;s up to you whether those consequence are worth it.
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Turing_Machine将近 2 年前
Link to Patrick McKenzie (the actual source, rather than Cory Doctorow&#x27;s blogspam):<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.bitsaboutmoney.com&#x2F;archive&#x2F;the-waste-stream-of-consumer-finance&#x2F;" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.bitsaboutmoney.com&#x2F;archive&#x2F;the-waste-stream-of-c...</a>
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willprice89将近 2 年前
&gt; One other thing debt collectors due is robo-sue their targets, bulk-filing boilerplate suits against debtors, real and imaginary. If you don&#x27;t show up for court (which is what usually happens), they&#x27;ll get a default judgment, and with it, the legal right to raid your bank account and your paycheck. That, in turn, is an asset that, once again, the debt collector can sell to an even scummier bottom-feeder, pocketing a lump sum.<p>I feel like this paragraph basically invalidates the rest of the article. If it&#x27;s this easy for them to sue and get legal access to your money how is paying &quot;optional&quot;?
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pier25将近 2 年前
Isn&#x27;t there like a credit score system in the US that companies can check?<p>In Mexico there&#x27;s something called the Credit Office (buró de crédito) that banks can check if you&#x27;ve paid all your debts.
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jwie将近 2 年前
When creditors sell debt to collections they should be required to allow the debtor to buy their debt back at that price.<p>Of course they&#x27;ll never actually do that. Usurers are unreceptive to any notion that you won&#x27;t pay every last extortionate penny. They&#x27;d rather sell it to collections for 5 cents on the dollar than let you settle for 50 in a straightforward conversation.
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tiahura将近 2 年前
As a lawyer who has fought a few collection cases, I would disagree with the notion that the collectors typically can’t document the debt. They can. Moreover the fdcpa doesn’t require the collector to prove the debt to you with absolute metaphysical certitude. They just have to verify it.
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viknesh将近 2 年前
&gt; the vast majority of consumers, including those with the socioeconomic wherewithal to walk away from their debts, feel themselves morally bound and pay as agreed<p>The extent to which the headline is true is probably only because of the above quote. If a significant number of people who actually had the means to pay simply chose not to, of course debtors would start taking collection more seriously.<p>Perhaps this means you could game the system, but I’m still skeptical that any debtor would choose not to sue you over 20k+ if they thought you had the means to pay.
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vel0city将近 2 年前
I&#x27;ve had things go to collections twice in my life, both times were some bill I forgot about and moved away and the first time I heard about being delinquent was the collections call. One time I asked for the evidence and they actually did mail me all the documentation and proof of the debt. The other time I asked for documentation and ended up never hearing from them again. I still don&#x27;t really know what that debt was, it never appeared on my credit history or anything else.
ransom1538将近 2 年前
Reminder. There are states that protect your home from judgements: &quot;exempts homestead property from levy and execution by judgment creditors&quot;. Medical bankruptcy should be <i>expected</i> and planned for - as you age it will be difficult to get health insurance. Move to states that will protect your home.
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BasedAnon将近 2 年前
The comedian (?) Sam Hyde is famous for doing this: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=BD5anPSzS-0&amp;t=220">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=BD5anPSzS-0&amp;t=220</a>
xwdv将近 2 年前
I wish there was a way we could automatically garnish any gratuities a debtor makes and put them toward a debt instead of the original business. With credit cards it should be more possible to do this.
yieldcrv将近 2 年前
One reason to pay is because you plan to borrow again<p>But if its already reached collections then it doesn’t really make a difference to your credit eligibility for the next X many years
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Bostonian将近 2 年前
You can believe that collection agencies behave illegally and also think that is unethical not to pay your debts to the best of your ability. Even if paying consumer debts is optional, not being able to get credit in the future, especially a home mortgage, is an incentive to pay. Some employers check the credit scores of applicants, and such scores probably are a decent indicator of whether someone has their life in order.
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c22将近 2 年前
That&#x27;s why the interest is so high...
tjrgergw将近 2 年前
What&#x27;s with people not offering RSS?
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syngrog66将近 2 年前
Federal debt? gov keep borrowing or printing more to payoff past debts<p>college debts? hope Dems get power in DC<p>biz debt? declare bankruptcy<p>its hard to find a type of debt that cant just be magically blinked away with a procedural wave of the hand
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