TE
科技回声
首页24小时热榜最新最佳问答展示工作
GitHubTwitter
首页

科技回声

基于 Next.js 构建的科技新闻平台,提供全球科技新闻和讨论内容。

GitHubTwitter

首页

首页最新最佳问答展示工作

资源链接

HackerNews API原版 HackerNewsNext.js

© 2025 科技回声. 版权所有。

It’s time to allow researchers to submit manuscripts to multiple journals

173 点作者 wjb3超过 1 年前

23 条评论

rjurney超过 1 年前
It is time to burn traditional academic publishing to the ground and rebuild it from the ground up, or else let&#x27;s rebel against the government, give Alexandra Elbakyan citizenship and put her in charge of the Department of Energy to make all computer science research open domain for all the world to see. Requesting $48 for to read a paper funded by your taxes before you even know it is useful to your work will result in deportation or a firing squad, whichever a panel of independent reviewers decides.<p>A less spirited method is to let traditional publishing slowly die by adding review features to highly viable alternatives like arXiv, PubMed and others which will then replace it. I hate academic publishers, they are vultures that serve no purpose. I hope they all go out of business or somehow pay big :)
评论 #37856138 未加载
评论 #37856184 未加载
评论 #37887683 未加载
评论 #37858551 未加载
mycologos超过 1 年前
I do computer science research and publish regularly (in conferences, not journals, since that&#x27;s how computer science mostly works -- you write a paper, look for the soonest upcoming relevant conference deadline, submit there, and get a response 2-3 months later). I think discussions about peer review often fail to explain all of the things peer review can accomplish:<p>1) Verifying that work is correct, assuming that the author is honest (e.g., you take their data at face value)<p>2) Verifying that work is correct, assuming that the author is malicious (e.g., you scrutinize their data to see if it&#x27;s fabricated)<p>3) Certifying that the paper is &quot;interesting&quot; (universities, grant-making bodies, and other bureaucratic entities want some evidence that the researcher their funding is good, and somebody has to hand out the gold stars)<p>It takes time for even an expert to do 1), and it takes still more time to do 2). There aren&#x27;t really good incentives to do it beyond caring about your field, or wanting to build on the thing you&#x27;re reading. 3) can be done more quickly, but it&#x27;s subjective, but a world where things are only assessed for correctness and not interesting-ness is a world where external funding bodies rely on other weird proxies like citation metrics or something to figure out who&#x27;s good, and it&#x27;s not clear to me that that&#x27;s better.<p>My perception from computer science is that it should be <i>harder</i> to submit papers, because there are too many authors who simply rarely produce good papers and are clogging up the conferences with endless resubmissions until they get reviewers lazy enough to all say &quot;weak accept&quot;.
评论 #37854588 未加载
评论 #37856572 未加载
ssivark超过 1 年前
The best way to allow multiple submissions while amortizing the review work is to make reviews (and rebuttals) public, and overlay them on submissions made public on some preprint server.<p>This establishes priority (if credit is a concern), can be made blind &#x2F; double-blind if so desired, and also makes public the reviews (which are as much a public service as writing research papers). Which editorial boards “accept” the paper for publication is then simply a matter of collecting <i>endorsement tags</i> on the submission.
评论 #37854381 未加载
评论 #37851503 未加载
JR1427超过 1 年前
Speaking as a former scientist, it&#x27;s worth remembering that peer review is not just about ensuring quality by preventing poor research being published. It also leads to good research being improved, in a very similar way to how code review can improve good code.<p>So doing away with peer review would have some negative consequences.<p>It&#x27;s also worth remembering that journals are really not very different to newspapers, and the top journals are the tabloids. They want to publish things that people will read and cite. They only care about quality in so far as it is required for people to want to read a paper. Ever wandered why so many top journal papers get retracted? It&#x27;s because the top journals know people will read the click-bait! My favourite example is when the Lancet published the famous MMR-Autism paper by Wakefield, which is terribly unscientific, but was bound to be much cited.
评论 #37858014 未加载
评论 #37857156 未加载
chriskanan超过 1 年前
He mentions that there is a conflict of interest with recommending peer reviewers. While I agree this can be abused, I&#x27;ve often run into cargo cult science in AI when publishing something that is valid, novel, and in my opinion advances the field, because it is not aligned with how past work defined the problem when submitting to conferences where I cannot recommend more senior scientists as reviewers. Recommending people could help a lot to address this.<p>For example, in continual deep learning people often use time datasets in which they use a small amount of memory and incrementally learn classes and the algorithms cannot work for other incremental learning distributions. It&#x27;s been very hard to publish work that instead works well for arbitrary multiple distributions, eliminates the memory constraint (which doesn&#x27;t matter in the real world mostly), and shows it scales to real datasets. We have been able to get huge reductions in training time with no loss in predictive ability, but can&#x27;t seem to get any of these papers published because the community says it is too unorthodox. It is far more efficient than periodically retraining as done in industry, which is what industry folks always tell me is the application they want from continual learning.<p>The confusing thing is that when I give talks or serve on panels I always have folks thank me and tell me they think this is the right direction and it was inspiring.<p>In my field the review system is way overtaxed with too many inexperienced people who struggle with having a broad perspective, so I think submitting to more venues would probably make things worse.
评论 #37855862 未加载
bo1024超过 1 年前
Computer Science&#x27;s conventions solve these problems (although CS certainly has other problems):<p><pre><code> * papers are generally posted to arxiv.org immediately on being finished, so everyone can access them * conferences have fixed deadlines and relatively short, fixed&#x2F;enforced review cycles</code></pre>
评论 #37851289 未加载
评论 #37855513 未加载
评论 #37851198 未加载
bluenose69超过 1 年前
The author suggests that &quot;The fear that multiple submissions would overwhelm the peer-review system lacks empirical evidence&quot;. Maybe it won&#x27;t &quot;overwhelm&quot; it, but it will certainly add to the reviewing workload. Simply stated, if authors submit to N journals and each asks for 2 reviewers, that&#x27;s 2N units of work (assuming they can get the reviewers), compared to 2 units of work.<p>But it may be worse than that, actually. I will not be much inclined to bother reviewing, if I know that the authors might pull their manuscript if another journal gives a green light quicker than the journal for which I have been asked to review.<p>The solution to a slow reviewing process is not to ask reviewers to do more of this unrewarded work.
评论 #37856044 未加载
limbicsystem超过 1 年前
I&#x27;ve often wondered if it might be possible to set up an &#x27;auction&#x27; system for papers. Post on arXiv and then have journals &#x27;bid&#x27; for publication - saying how much they would charge in publication fees, review turnaround etc. Authors can then choose the journal they prefer. The advantage would be that the initial stage of &#x27;shopping around&#x27; would be eliminated (sending a paper to a journal and being rejected without review) and there would be incentive for journals to reduce publication fees. Just a thought...
dash2超过 1 年前
&quot;The fear that multiple submissions would overwhelm the peer-review system lacks empirical evidence and is outweighed by the burden placed on researchers.&quot;<p>Actually, here&#x27;s a paper showing that the peer review is already overstretched:<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;arxiv.org&#x2F;abs&#x2F;2309.15884" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;arxiv.org&#x2F;abs&#x2F;2309.15884</a>
hedora超过 1 年前
This is a terrible idea.<p>The biggest problem I see with the current system is that a small number of authors venue shop by repeatedly submitting the same paper without changes.<p>Allowing submissions to happen in parallel will benefit that group of bad actors to the detriment to pretty much everyone else.<p>Also, all submitting in parallel will do is increase the number of erroneously accepted submissions. For one thing, typical reviewers review for multiple conferences, so you&#x27;d just be sending the same manuscript to the same person multiple times. Also, most related conferences have a fairly similar bar.<p>In fact, most papers have pretty good alignment on reviews. Reviewers typically can&#x27;t see each other&#x27;s reviews or discuss the paper before submitting their review, so these are mostly independent samples. There are papers that have bimodal scores, but it&#x27;s rare, and usually due to low confidence reviews or the very occasional controversial paper.<p>It is often detected when people just ignore previous reviews, and resubmit without revision. Typically, one reviewer will overlap between the two conferences and notice the resubmission. If the paper hasn&#x27;t changed, that&#x27;s an easy reject, even if the person wasn&#x27;t assigned to review it. Allowing parallel submissions would normalize this class of denial of service attack against reviewers.<p>Also, far more often, the previous reviewer will take a look, and say that the authors did a good job addressing the previous group&#x27;s concerns. Of course, that can&#x27;t happen if the paper is submitted in parallel. Allowing parallel submissions would put people that actually improve their work between submissions at an unfair disadvantage.
CobrastanJorji超过 1 年前
While we&#x27;re talking about needed journal changes, it&#x27;s worth pointing out that Nature, the journal, now allows articles submitted by authors to be open to anyone, which is great, but only if the authors pay Nature $11,690 per article. Otherwise, only institutions which subscribe to Nature can see the articles.
评论 #37854596 未加载
评论 #37852460 未加载
ahmedsaad1977超过 1 年前
If the peer reivew is turned into a properly paid work through a platform, many researchers from under-developed countries will surely join to become reveiwers. This will bridge the demand-supply gap and and make the publishing faster.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.thelancet.com&#x2F;journals&#x2F;lancet&#x2F;article&#x2F;PIIS0140-6736(21)02804-X&#x2F;fulltext" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.thelancet.com&#x2F;journals&#x2F;lancet&#x2F;article&#x2F;PIIS0140-6...</a>
评论 #37855018 未加载
评论 #37854683 未加载
kryptiskt超过 1 年前
I&#x27;d rather do away with the whole publish or perish thing.<p>One half-baked idea: For academic hiring, only ever judge the quality of a candidate&#x27;s research based on their five best papers (as they themselves have nominated), then there is no pressure to publish anything that doesn&#x27;t break into the top five.
评论 #37854606 未加载
评论 #37856500 未加载
kukkeliskuu超过 1 年前
I think one of the root causes for the problems in publishing is that &quot;original&quot; research has much higher status than the grunt work that contributes to the quality of research.<p>PhD students should probably spend much of their effort in trying to replicate published research papers, instead of publishing &quot;original&quot; research. This would teach them a lot about the typical quality issues in their research field, allowing them to produce quality &quot;original&quot; papers later.<p>This may sometimes even allow them to publish highly influencial papers that show the limitations of published papers, because quality issues seem so widely spread. This would also allow them to really contribute to the field.<p>I think we would see this if Universities and journals would take the research quality seriously.
tiahura超过 1 年前
Why don’t universities publish their own journals in the sciences like they do for law? Why don’t we have the Stanford AI Review or the University of Michigan Journal of Organic Chemistry. Like law, turn them over to the grad students to publish.
评论 #37868374 未加载
markhahn超过 1 年前
journal &quot;monogamy&quot; is the problem.<p>modest proposal: always publish to arxiv, which assigns the permanent DOI. journals can be offered the article - one at a time if the authors desire, or in more of an auction format. when published in a journal, the arxiv entry is simply updated (new revision findable and attached to the original DOI).<p>this would make research works first-class, rather than journal byproducts.<p>internet&#x2F;telecom providers don&#x27;t want to be dumb-fat-pipes; journals don&#x27;t want to be editing and review-coordination services. so what?
评论 #37858173 未加载
10g1k超过 1 年前
Tip: Magazines are not part of the scientific process. It is a parasitic industry riding on the back of science to make money. You can do as much science as you want, and not publish it anywhere. Or you can publish it on your own website if you feel the need. But publishing is NOT part of the scientific process.
dbingham超过 1 年前
I&#x27;ve been working on improving academic publishing and review from a software angle for a year a half. I think there&#x27;s a ton of room for improvement here (all the software tools journal teams have available to them leave a lot to be desired). In improving the tooling, I think we can make the work of editors and reviewers <i>a lot</i> easier and that will increase the response time of reviews. We can also help editorial teams that want to experiment with things like multiple submissions, or open submissions.<p>I&#x27;m currently building a platform that aims to make these improvements and enable these experiments - the working title is &quot;JournalHub&quot;. The one liner might be &quot;Github for Journals&quot;. It&#x27;s in alpha and currently supports preprints and preprint review, journal publishing flows, and post-publication review. I&#x27;ve done a bunch of iteration on the review UX, which draws heavily on Google Docs and Github PRs, and that&#x27;s getting pretty close to beta. I&#x27;m still working on the editorial workflows which are in early alpha.<p>Once we have a platform that a significant number of journals are using, we can then build opt-in experiments with peer review. An example particularly relevant to the OP is potentially allowing multiple submissions where each editorial and review team can see the other&#x27;s comments and thus multiple journals can collaboratively review a paper and benefit from each other&#x27;s work. I&#x27;ve talked to editors who actually suggested the idea while doing UX research, so it&#x27;s not unfathomable that journals might opt-in to something like that.<p>My impression from UX research is that there are actually a lot of editorial teams aware of the problems with journal publishing and eager to experiment, but feeling restricted by the mandates of the commercial publishers. So my main goal right now is to enable editorial teams to escape the commercial publishers, to free their hands, and enable their experiments.<p>I&#x27;m still doing UX research and looking for editors and editorial teams interested in talking - so if you&#x27;re a journal editor and you want to help develop a platform that might help you escape the commercial publishers, reach out! (Email: dbingham@theroadgoeson.com)
SubiculumCode超过 1 年前
I want to post my research and journals compete to publish it
评论 #37854392 未加载
seydor超过 1 年前
... because nothing is more pleasant than revising multiple manuscripts with different requirements at the same time?
zaptheimpaler超过 1 年前
this is such a joke of a system. half of the web is a system for peer review already. you could basically repurpose any old forum software like Discourse or Reddit, twitter, mastodon to work as peer review. It&#x27;s just people commenting on a post! With a system for verifying identity (use official email) and assigning reviewers maybe.<p>Then over here we see a journal publishing this trash that treats their audience as toddlers with amazing tips like<p>&quot;Follow up: after submission, &quot;<p>&quot;Professional networks:..&quot;<p>Mostly I&#x27;m just surprised that our smartest people put up with this, when any researcher could ask their CS colleagues to create a replacement over a few weeks. It&#x27;s a pure social coordination problem, it would only take a few groups of researchers switching to light the fire. It&#x27;s a preference cascade just waiting for a little nudge.
PaulHoule超过 1 年前
Peer review is a joke. Peer reviewers don’t look at your data and the programs you used to analyze it. They don’t look at your experimental apparatus, they don’t repeat your experiment, they don’t talk to the subjects you interviewed, at best they can spot obvious “red flags”.<p>(Of course, in 2023 you should be able to publish your data and all your software with the paper.)
评论 #37851505 未加载
评论 #37851044 未加载
评论 #37851680 未加载
评论 #37851285 未加载
评论 #37851032 未加载
评论 #37855523 未加载
评论 #37851086 未加载
评论 #37851585 未加载
评论 #37851741 未加载
评论 #37852277 未加载
Metacelsus超过 1 年前
As someone currently preparing a manuscript for submission (and choosing which journal to send it to), I definitely agree.