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Lemming Suicide Myth: Disney Film Faked Bogus Behavior

235 点作者 oppodeldoc超过 1 年前

22 条评论

somenameforme超过 1 年前
The scene may have been staged, but Wiki&#x27;s entry on them suggests the demonstrated behavior is completely authentic, instead taking a more semantic argument about the term suicide:<p>---<p>&quot;Lemmings have become the subject of a widely popular misconception that they are driven to commit mass suicide when they migrate by jumping off cliffs. It is not a deliberate mass suicide, in which animals voluntarily choose to die, but rather a result of their migratory behavior. Driven by strong biological urges, some species of lemmings may migrate in large groups when population density becomes too great. They can swim and may choose to cross a body of water in search of a new habitat. In such cases, many drown if the body of water is an ocean or is so wide as to exceed their physical capabilities. Thus, the unexplained fluctuations in the population of Norwegian lemmings, and perhaps a small amount of semantic confusion (suicide not being limited to voluntary deliberation, but also the result of foolishness), helped give rise to the popular stereotype of the suicidal lemmings, particularly after this behaviour was staged in the Walt Disney documentary White Wilderness in 1958.[12] The misconception itself is much older, dating back to at least the late 19th century. In the August 1877 issue of Popular Science Monthly, apparently suicidal lemmings are presumed to be swimming the Atlantic Ocean in search of the submerged continent of Lemuria.[13]&quot;<p>---<p>The Disney Film narrated the event (from the article) as, &quot;A kind of compulsion seizes each tiny rodent and, carried along by an unreasoning hysteria, each falls into step for a march that will take them to a strange destiny. That destiny is to jump into the ocean. As they approach the sea, they&#x27;ve become victims of an obsession -- a one-track thought: Move on! Move on!&quot;<p>That does not seem especially inaccurate.<p>[1] - <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Lemming" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Lemming</a>
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pastrami_panda超过 1 年前
I was hiking a summer when there was a &#x27;lemming year&#x27;. You saw thousands of tiny carcasses strewn everywhere during that week, you accidently stepped on them as they ran under your hiking boots mid-step, if you sat down off trail they would start running up to you and attack. It was very surreal, they are very cute but also very fierce. Seeing a lemming run up to you and stand up on its hind legs and produce a high pitched shriek to intimidate you is something I&#x27;ll never forget. Very strange animals.
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PeterStuer超过 1 年前
I remember walking the Norwegian mountain trails in late summer in a &#x27;lemming year&#x27;. The lemming population explosion is so ridiculous you had to constantly look at your feet to avoid stepping on them, both live ones that sometimes puff their chests and make a big scene, as well as corpses littered all over the path.
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pricci超过 1 年前
&gt; The lemmings supposedly committing mass suicide by leaping into the ocean were actually thrown off a cliff by the Disney filmmakers.<p>I guess the 50s where different times
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erickhill超过 1 年前
&quot;Lemmings do not commit mass suicide. It&#x27;s a myth, but it&#x27;s remarkable how many people believe it.&quot;<p>The sensational Amiga puzzle video game called &quot;Lemmings&quot; helped perpetuate the idea, too. :)
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totetsu超过 1 年前
They say its a Myth, but then<p>&gt;&quot;What people see is essentially mass dispersal,&quot; said zoologist Gordon Jarrell, an expert in small mammals with the University of Alaska Fairbanks. &quot;Sometimes it&#x27;s pretty directional. The classic example is in the Scandinavian mountains, where (lemmings) have been dramatically observed. They will come to a body of water and be temporarily stopped, and eventually they&#x27;ll build up along the shore so dense and they will swim across. If they get wet to the skin, they &#x27;re essentially dead.&quot;
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furyofantares超过 1 年前
Pretty weird to see a &quot;debunking&quot; of &quot;bogus behavior&quot; followed up with descriptions of actual behavior that&#x27;s pretty dang close to my impression of what they did. I never heard of it or thought of it as suicide.<p>It does sound like the Disney film, which almost none of the readers will have seen but a clip from, was totally fake and vile and was in fact bogus behavior in that it also wasn&#x27;t even the right type of lemming. Everything about that sucks.<p>But it also kinda sucks that most of the article misled me; it wasn&#x27;t until the description at the end and then reading the wikipedia and accounts here that I reverted back to somewhere near the initial impression I had.<p>Maybe I&#x27;m the weird one, and the popular idea really is about intentional suicide. But I always thought the popular idea was that sometimes large groups of them follow each other to their doom.<p>I mean, I appreciate the added nuance that 1) they were probably gonna die if they stayed where they were to begin with, there&#x27;s just too many of them and 2) it&#x27;s more commonly a very deadly trek, not literally the whole group dying at once, though it sounds like that does happen sometimes [and I only ever had the impression that it happens sometimes].
eddyfromtheblok超过 1 年前
congratulations to whomever amongst you who capitalized on this and initially created the Lemmings game for the Amiga
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JKCalhoun超过 1 年前
Saw this oddity on a wild film-loop projector when I was in Junior high school. If anyone remember&#x27;s these (I remember them from the 1970&#x27;s) they were the film equivalent of the 8-track tapeL: an endless loop of 8mm film (probably only 50 feet or so of film) in an odd chunky cartridge that you slammed into a small projector.<p>I guess they were the analog version of TikTok.<p>(Edit: appears they were called &quot;Magi-Cartridge&quot;: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;youtu.be&#x2F;tEshEHC78no?si=SaJk9aLkNUJpm-XK" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;youtu.be&#x2F;tEshEHC78no?si=SaJk9aLkNUJpm-XK</a>)
cratermoon超过 1 年前
When I was studying documentary methods in media studies, this was widely shared. There were (and are) many things calling themselves documentaries but are closer to entertaining simulations.<p>The difference between what&#x27;s allowed for popular media and what research professionals would accept is pretty wide.
the_af超过 1 年前
Disney is an extreme offender here (I mean, dropping lemmings off a cliff, what where they thinking?), but I hear some of what we &quot;know&quot; about animals is sometimes an honest mistake and may be the result of an involuntary artifacts of researcher involvement.<p>Don&#x27;t know if it&#x27;s true, but a couple of examples I&#x27;ve read:<p>It&#x27;s not true that wolves live in &quot;packs&quot; and that there are alpha and beta males. In truth wolves form families of the breeding couple and their cubs, and that&#x27;s it. Saying daddy and mommy wolf are the &quot;alphas&quot; is a trivial assertion. But apparently this dynamic is broken for wolves in captivity, and the artificial alpha&#x2F;beta thing arises.<p>Female praying mantises do not regularly chomp on the male&#x27;s head while mating. It&#x27;s true they are highly cannibalistic and will eat another mantis if they can, but while mating the males usually have tactics to avoid this fate; it&#x27;s only under <i>observation</i> by researchers that the female gets more aggressive and the male less prone to escaping.<p>Not sure if either is true, but I&#x27;m willing to entertain the notion they may be.
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nineteen999超过 1 年前
It even made it into a Donald Duck comic, &quot;The Lemming with the Locket&quot;:<p><a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;duckcomicsrevue.blogspot.com&#x2F;2019&#x2F;01&#x2F;the-lemming-with-locket.html" rel="nofollow noreferrer">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;duckcomicsrevue.blogspot.com&#x2F;2019&#x2F;01&#x2F;the-lemming-with...</a><p>Remember reading this one as a kid.
whoopdedo超过 1 年前
I&#x27;ve always suspected that the myth is due to the Bible. Mark 5:11-13<p>&gt; Now there was there nigh unto the mountains a great herd of swine feeding. And all the devils besought him, saying, Send us into the swine, that we may enter into them. And forthwith Jesus gave them leave. And the unclean spirits went out, and entered into the swine: and the herd ran violently down a steep place into the sea, (they were about two thousand;) and were choked in the sea.<p>As noted, migrating lemmings will congregate at the edge of a cliff where some unfortunate clumsy ones will fall off. Someone seeing this would surely be reminded of the Bible passage and be tempted to imagine the creatures had been driven to suicide by demons.
wly_cdgr超过 1 年前
TIL that lemmings are a real animal
efitz超过 1 年前
As a child, I saw the Disney documentary numerous times (reruns on Sunday nights; there were only 3 TV channels). I believed the story into adulthood, having no reason to believe that Disney would fake a nature documentary.
troyvit超过 1 年前
If you want to listen to a fun podcast that gets into this:<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.goloudnow.com&#x2F;podcasts&#x2F;no-such-thing-as-a-fish-154&#x2F;452-no-such-thing-as-lemming-atlantis-374017" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.goloudnow.com&#x2F;podcasts&#x2F;no-such-thing-as-a-fish-1...</a>
40four超过 1 年前
I love nature documentaries so much! They are beautiful, entertaining, and informative. But this makes me wonder how many other ideas have they have mislead me on? Do we need to worry about nature documentaries being a type of propaganda?
ClimaxGravely超过 1 年前
This reminds me when I found out the truth of a childhood movie of mine : Milo and Otis
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happytiger超过 1 年前
Someone should make a Disney movie about homocidal lemmings next and see if we can get that to stick too.<p>Little gangs of lemmings throwing other lemmings into the sea.<p>That would rule. Disney would be proud.
ourmandave超过 1 年前
If I were a writer for the next Squid Games, I&#x27;d be toying with this concept.
mcpackieh超过 1 年前
It remains common practice for nature &quot;documentaries&quot; to create fake narratives in editing. Pay attention to cuts, camera angles and changes in background scenery and you&#x27;ll notice quite a lot of it. If they&#x27;re showing two animals in some sort of confrontation but only ever show one of the animals at a time, you can be sure it&#x27;s fake. If they&#x27;re showing something that has several camera angles it&#x27;s probably fake, particularly if some of the camera angles are very close or in a position that should make the cameraman visible in the other angles.<p>That popular video of a lizard running through a gauntlet of snakes is very fake. They probably spliced together many days of footage using captured lizards and snakes.
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wryoak超过 1 年前
I think, generationally, we’ve reached a point where more people know this scene was staged than have actually seen it.