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Rabbit: LLM-First Mobile Phone

352 点作者 DreamGen超过 1 年前

154 条评论

amne超过 1 年前
I don&#x27;t think he touched the scroll wheel in the keynote. Why is it there? What does it do? I found it awkward he scrolled by touching the screen across the damn scroll wheel. Just use it. At least in the keynote.<p>And then there are so many questions about the hardware capabilities of this device:<p>- where is the inference running? I don&#x27;t believe it&#x27;s on the device. And if it&#x27;s in the cloud then why make the claim it is under 500ms? Is that just a &quot;don&#x27;t you guys have low-latency 4g at home?&quot; moment?<p>- how is that tiny camera capable of parsing a small-text table with 100% accuracy? the optics just don&#x27;t allow it to.<p>- what&#x27;s the battery life with that kind of usage? If inference is running on device it must be very low. Just thinking that my GPU pulls 50-100W on average (with spikes to 200W) just to suggest code I still don&#x27;t think rabbit is doing anything on device. If it&#x27;s cloud based then 4g is also a battery destroyer. Maybe that&#x27;s why the device is so big: huge battery inside.<p>The &quot;teach&quot; session was definitely cool. But at this point it must be magic because there&#x27;s no way that thing browsed to a discord server, authenticated with hallucinated credentials and it just worked.
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thih9超过 1 年前
Note that this is not a Teenage Engineering product.<p>This is a product sold by Rabbit - and they hired TE to help as a design agency.
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dang超过 1 年前
Other links for figuring out what this is:<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.theverge.com&#x2F;2024&#x2F;1&#x2F;9&#x2F;24030667&#x2F;rabbit-r1-ai-action-model-price-release-date" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.theverge.com&#x2F;2024&#x2F;1&#x2F;9&#x2F;24030667&#x2F;rabbit-r1-ai-acti...</a> (via <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=38933819">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=38933819</a>, but no comments there)<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;techcrunch.com&#x2F;2024&#x2F;01&#x2F;09&#x2F;can-a-striking-design-set-rabbits-r1-pocket-ai-apart-from-a-gaggle-of-virtual-assistants&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;techcrunch.com&#x2F;2024&#x2F;01&#x2F;09&#x2F;can-a-striking-design-set-...</a> (via <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=38932575">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=38932575</a>, but no comments there)<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.tomsguide.com&#x2F;reviews&#x2F;rabbit-r1" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.tomsguide.com&#x2F;reviews&#x2F;rabbit-r1</a>
jmull超过 1 年前
I&#x27;m not sure people want an LLM assistant that can actually do things like spend their money.<p>A minor convenience when it works well. A major inconvenience when it doesn&#x27;t. (And it doesn&#x27;t take a lot of imagination to come up with nightmare scenarios.)<p>Love the gadget, though. I feel like I want to eat it or build a Lego castle around it, or just look at it more.
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modeless超过 1 年前
$199 with no subscription? You must have to bring your own data sim card. Or can it get its connection from your phone? And is the AI stuff running locally on the device? Impressive if so. Suspicious if not; there&#x27;s no way the service remains free forever.<p>Pretty compelling price, and I&#x27;m certain the vision of AI agents that can use any existing app or website to take actions on your behalf is the future of computing. But there&#x27;s no room in my pocket for a second device. I don&#x27;t see how a device is going to succeed when an equivalent app for existing phones seems around the corner.
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Darthy超过 1 年前
In the linked keynote, Jesse Lyu mentions that LLM won&#x27;t help us actually do tasks - there are currently no so-called &quot;agents&quot; that do something simple like book a flight - the best way to do it is still to click the buttons yourself.<p>Rabbit means to solve that by creating a &quot;LAM&quot;, a &quot;Large Action model&quot;, which is a service by Rabbit that will click interfaces for you. I&#x27;m not sure this is the right approach - if it is successful, it will lead to more centralisation around Rabbit.<p>I agree this is a problem, but I feel a better approach would be to have a market of agents that for a small fee actually handle the whole transaction for you. So there might be multiple parties that say they can buy Delta Flight DL101 tomorrow 21:10 for various prices - some might be a service like the Rabbit LAM, others might be booking platforms, and there might even be airlines themselves. And now an agent-concierge that you choose once at the start will look at all the parties, and then pick and buy the right flight for you. This will make the problem a problem of an open market, where good speedy service is promoted, and prices get ever lower. And if the Rabbit LAM gets outcompeted by an ever better speedier solution, that would be a good thing. (This will also allow us to move away from our current dreaded attention-based economy where e.g. a booking websites tries to exploit your required presence during waiting times, which the LAMs would also solve, but, like I said, let&#x27;s not move towards more centralisation.)
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Calamityjanitor超过 1 年前
This is exactly what Siri wanted to be. Compare with the original Siri keynote <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;vimeo.com&#x2F;5424527" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;vimeo.com&#x2F;5424527</a><p>I can&#x27;t find the exact ~2010 article from before being bought by Apple. I remember in an interview they were talking about making a web agent that could operate and perform tasks on any website, to avoid being locked out by APIs.
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amadeuspagel超过 1 年前
What&#x27;s the advantage of this vs a smartphone? Realistically, are you going to carry two gadgets with you? I feel like a lot of people don&#x27;t like the smartphone, because, being a general purpose computer, it takes away the excuse to buy all sorts of different gadgets.
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edude03超过 1 年前
I read the comments before I watched the video and I&#x27;m actually way more optimistic about this now than I was expecting to be.<p>Yes, google or apple will probably ship LLMs on their phones eventually and make an overall more compelling product than Rabbit _if_ you&#x27;re only willing to have one device.<p>Considering the relatively low price (and assuming they actually deliver it in a timely fashion) I can see this being useful as a pocket assistant between now and whenever google et al eventually catch up, and potentially past then if rabbit keeps innovating.
crakhamster01超过 1 年前
This is a pretty neat device. I think they might be more successful if they targeted the anti-smartphone crowd, but I can see why they would want to chase the bigger market.<p>Lyu hit the nail on the head when he said that smartphones are mostly for entertainment&#x2F;wasting time these days. I definitely know of friends who want to (or try to) go smartphone free, but the apps mentioned in the keynote make it a large inconvenience. A $200 device that offers much of the convenience of a smartphone without the distraction sounds like a good fit for that crowd.
thallavajhula超过 1 年前
Teenage Engineering&#x27;s hardware design is so cool. I&#x27;m a fan of their aesthetics. Their color choices are great too.
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ssgodderidge超过 1 年前
I see this as less of a competitor to a smartphone, and more of a competitor to a Light Phone [1]. Seems like it might help folks avoid doom-scrolling in a similar way, while providing a higher level of functionality.<p>[1] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.thelightphone.com&#x2F;shop&#x2F;products&#x2F;light-phone-ii-black" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.thelightphone.com&#x2F;shop&#x2F;products&#x2F;light-phone-ii-b...</a>
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rgbrgb超过 1 年前
Note that this is a Teenage Engineering collab! Pretty exciting and a crazy low price point for something with their name on it.<p>This isn&#x27;t a phone though right? The title seems wrong.
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dvt超过 1 年前
I feel like the R1 is getting a lot of weird hate here on HN. I get it, it&#x27;s a bit pretentious and wants to be very Apple-like, yadda yadda. Probably not that much value generation, it&#x27;s overpriced, and no one wants to carry another thing in their pocket. And yes, the company will likely go bankrupt (or pivot into something less exciting). It&#x27;s also all in the cloud (no local inference) so it doesn&#x27;t really even &quot;do&quot; that much. But seriously: this is (or should be) the future of computing. The fact that things like OS self-organization, system-wide (+cloud) search, basic automation, etc. is so broken on modern operating systems is just plain bizarre.<p>For example, if I wanted to do a simple find-and-replace on my 2021 M1, I&#x27;d have to use something like grep (a tool originally written by Ken Thompson in 1973—a <i>half century</i> before my laptop was built) and look up flags and syntax I inevitably constantly forget. We should have been past this at least 15 years ago.
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krunck超过 1 年前
No thanks. I&#x27;ll wait until the LLM&#x2F;AI is resident on the phone and can be updated&#x2F;replaced by the end user.
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josephwegner超过 1 年前
How in the world are they going to make money on this? Perhaps the hardware is cheap to manufacture, but with no subscription I feel like they are going to get taken to the cleaner on LLM API fees. Even if they&#x27;re running the LLM themselves, it&#x27;s not cheap. Could they really be getting enough margin on the device to pay their staff _and_ all of that infra?<p>Or maybe this is another VC-backed sale price :)
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pmuse超过 1 年前
Cool product but I agree with others that their site does not really demonstrate the value proposition of the device in a clear way. You shouldn&#x27;t have to watch the keynote to understand what it is.<p>I also have a hard time believing it will work as well as they say it does gen-1 at a $200 price point. I&#x27;m very skeptical.<p>The teenage engineering design is nice though, looks like something out of the movie Her.
mightyham超过 1 年前
The value preposition here seems pretty weak. AI voice assistants are, in my experience, one of the worst ways to interact with a computer. What does this device offer that I can&#x27;t already do on my cell phone?
LASR超过 1 年前
Quick feedback if the founders are watching this: Please allow controls on your keynote video. The video production quality looks great. But I am not watching it if I don&#x27;t know if it&#x27;s a 30s one or a 30minute one.
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sergiomattei超过 1 年前
This landing page is an utter failure. I can’t believe this got past anyone.<p>I’ve read the whole thing and I still have no idea what it does or what problem it solves. I’m not watching a Keynote to find out either.<p>Who made this?
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northes超过 1 年前
I don&#x27;t want to be mean, but...<p>- the keynote video isn&#x27;t scrollable behind the giant &quot;share&quot; button - the text on the keynote page is incredibly difficult to read (small text + very low contrast) - the homepage is full of dizzying animations that don&#x27;t tell me anything about what the &quot;phone&quot; is actually supposed to do - &quot;How it works&quot; is just a set of animated cards. Once you figure out they&#x27;re clickable (hoverable?), they spin around to reveal... half-formed ad copy? I wanted to know how it worked.<p>I&#x27;m willing to believe this is a real product only because of the &quot;research&quot; page, but it feels more like an aspiring web designer&#x27;s portfolio piece. The flashiness of it all makes it really difficult to figure out what anything actually is.
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georgehill超过 1 年前
Very interesting approach teachable agents. There is something similar, but without screen recording [1].<p>1. <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;vignshwarar&#x2F;AI-Employe#:~:text=we%20don&#x27;t%20record%20the%20screen%2C%20microphone%2C%20or%20camera%2C%20but%20we%20do%20record%20the%20dom%20element%20changes" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;vignshwarar&#x2F;AI-Employe#:~:text=we%20don&#x27;t...</a>
mathewsanders超过 1 年前
It’s a really interesting product that I’m not going to buy!<p>Declarative interfaces that allow you to describe what you want and use agents to go out to different services and chain them together is a cool idea:<p>I don’t want to spend time using dozens of different apps with different (often poorly designed) interfaces.<p>Having a push to talk hardware button instead seems less clunky than a “hey siri” key phrase (I use Siri dozens of times a day but unfortunately ‘raise to talk’ feature on Apple Watch has never worked well for me).<p>I’m curious how their LAM works with interfaces being updated- if they need to retrain with UI updates or if it’s flexible enough to be stable with UI changes and new features etc.<p>I currently use ChatGTP sessions to dive into various topics I’m interested in, and explore ideas- I do like the idea of dedicated hardware that would allow this, but it’s something I imagine I’d keep on the coffee table at home, I don’t want to get a dedicated SIM and data connection or carry around another device.<p>They’ve raised $30M and I wish them well, I hope they survive and have me as a customer in the future.
natch超过 1 年前
So many questions. Is this a YC company? Did they apply? Does anyone know anything about them at all? It just screams scam to me. Who would give them $200 for vapor? [Edit: I have been told the device has been demoed in a comment below, so perhaps it might be real.]<p>Let’s say Apple were to do this. Apple would take years to get it right but when they announced it would be with a date with an accuracy to within a certain quarter. And it would just work on day one. Of course it would be saddled with subscriptions, but it would be real.<p>It just doesn’t smell right that a team led by a guy who can’t manage to pronounce his own first name clearly could think through all the issues and have a coherent vision within a year of when LLMs really took off.<p>Another possibility my paranoid mind comes up with here is the team&#x2F;founder caught wind of some half baked research from inside Apple and decided they would try to pull a fast one and whip out a product before Apple could. And by the way, again of course it’s vapor, until it’s not, but we are still at the “it is” stage.
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ramesh31超过 1 年前
Everyone wants so badly to be first to market with the &quot;next big thing&quot; after smart phones. And all of them fail the &quot;so it&#x27;s a phone, but just less capable?&quot; test.<p>A neat toy for hobbyists, but most people can&#x27;t justify carrying two devices. And as soon as you add phone functionality to it... you&#x27;ve just made a new (more awkward) smartphone.
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frogamel超过 1 年前
I must be missing something here. I used to work on a voice assistant product and everything demoed is pretty bog standard stuff: play music, shop, order food, get Uber rides, ask random queries, recognize images.<p>This also runs into the same core issue as voice assistants, which is that it&#x27;s way easier to transmit complex thoughts&#x2F;actions on a nice big visual UI than it is to convert those thoughts&#x2F;actions into verbal instructions.<p>For example, when people order food from an online menu, most people are not fine with &quot;get me the closest pizza available&quot;. They&#x27;re usually considering complex tradeoffs between lots of factors: alternative restaurants nearby, how visually appealing is pictures of the food, health content, other options on the menu including their prices and content and how well they complement other dishes, etc. Figuring out how to express these preferences via a back-and-forth with an AI is more tedious than just looking at a visual interface and letting your subconscious process all this information into a choice.
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leetharris超过 1 年前
I am almost never a hater on people trying ambitious things, but man this is one of the most &quot;doomed to fail&quot; things I&#x27;ve ever seen.<p>You&#x27;ve got absolutely insane market saturation by two major players that have some of the most advanced AI teams on the planet.<p>Almost nobody is going to buy an &quot;LLM-first phone,&quot; they will just wait for Apple or Google to put an LLM into their existing phone.
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leephillips超过 1 年前
I watched the first 2:51 or so of the keynote. The guy made a series of assertions that he seemed to think were self-evident. I disagreed with every one, without exception. I gave up when he described the LLM as “artificial intelligence”. I don’t think I’ll be a customer.
gumby超过 1 年前
I think this is Apple&#x27;s plan for the apple watch. I see my gf leave the house without her beloved iphone, making calls, listening to messages etc with her airpods connected to her watch. She doesn&#x27;t even touch it.<p>I might even have tried it myself if Siri didn&#x27;t suck to much. My experiments in this regard were...discouraging. Perhaps she radically restricts her use to things Siri understands (unlikely in her case) or she just knows how to speak in a way aligned to siri&#x27;s expectations).<p>Though the other night I did awake to her her firmly saying &quot;flashlight. flashlight. <i>flashlight</i>.&quot; for a bit followed by &quot;shit&quot; and a bit of fumbling at her wrist.
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thecrumb超过 1 年前
All I really saw is an awkward looking device (sorry TE) that probably wouldn&#x27;t fit in my pocket, and would probably break if dropped. And whatever they paid for the keynote was a waste of money. If you can&#x27;t explain how this works in about 30 seconds - I don&#x27;t care.
cwrichardkim超过 1 年前
I think the interesting bit here is actually the teachable mode (19:30 in the vid): <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;youtu.be&#x2F;22wlLy7hKP4?t=1174" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;youtu.be&#x2F;22wlLy7hKP4?t=1174</a><p>there are tools that exist that teach agents what to do, but the ability to have them on command and return a nice little summary in a neat UI is actually kind of compelling. It also feeds the company routine information to fine tune agents and maybe results in a dev ecosystem of some kind? need to learn more about how the system prevents some of the concerns hear like taking undesirable actions on your behalf
max_超过 1 年前
Who ever comes up with these Teenage Engineering designs is an actual, real genius!
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aetherspawn超过 1 年前
I wish they put it next to something, I have difficulty understanding the size of it. People in this thread are talking about it like it’s tiny, but I got the impression from the pictures that it was gameboy size.
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animex超过 1 年前
I know the $1000 device in my pocket is capable of all the things they implemented ... do I just wait for a Rabbit clone app? Or will Apple&#x2F;Google just enhance their native offerings to include this sort of thing. I absolutely agree with the premise. Our phones are just mini-desktop computers accumulating unused programs that don&#x27;t integrate with each other storing random bits of data all over itself. The whole device seems to be a more polished semantic web that we were promised years ago albeit being brute forced by AI because interop never evolved.
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caligarn超过 1 年前
I think what’s impressive here is their approach to “Teach Mode”, which essentially teaches the average consumer how machine learning works. I think that’s already a much better approach than Humane Ai and provides a better path long term for where this could go. This approach of a Large Action Model that can control any of your apps by watching you use them is a unique implementation for a hardware device. The hardware isn’t super impressive but the approach has staying power. It’s always way less invasive than Humane AI pin, it’s deliberate usage.
ianbicking超过 1 年前
This was what I had hoped might be possible years ago working on a voice assistant for a browser (Firefox Voice). That was all prototypish and desktop-focused, but the real potential I saw was in remote control of a cloud-based browser. Voice assistants without a way to execute actions are pretty limited. Google&#x2F;Siri&#x2F;Alexa built up those actions through sheer effort, creating integrations for everything, carefully handling the conflicts, etc. A cloud-based browser has the potential to maintain context and perform actions across everything right away, without that huge investment and need for market share, nor buy-in from service providers.<p>I&#x27;m not sure how exactly they handle the communication between that browser and the phone, but at least my sense of this is that they are doing what I imagine is &quot;standard&quot; browser automation (which is much more advanced with LLMs) and then something to reinterpret the output for the phone. You can do a lot with the mobile view of the sites, but they seem to be going further. (For something like Spotify I wonder if they are doing something site-specific)<p>The use of a browser offers interesting possibilities for auditing what is happening. With something like GPT Plugins you can see the JSON, but it&#x27;s not really equivalent to what you as a user understand.<p>Looking at them using Discord, it makes me think they must be doing automation through vision, detecting pixel locations, etc, as Discord is deliberately hard to automate.
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akrymski超过 1 年前
Imagine reading HN on this thing.<p>Voice chat with your computer is possibly the worst input method. UIs exist for a reason. Clicking a few buttons is much faster than a conversation. The future of computing doesn&#x27;t look like a bot that&#x27;s automating some website UI actions.<p>A legal aside: if an airline wants to make a sucky UI because its trying to upsell, should it be legal to allow users to skip over it? Is a company&#x27;s website any different to their physical storefront?
rhinoceraptor超过 1 年前
The hardware device itself is a bit of a red herring. It&#x27;s really a server-side LLM that is trained to use software on your behalf, presumably against server-side Android&#x2F;Chrome VMs that you authenticate to various apps&#x2F;services with OAuth.<p>At first it seems a bit like a kludge, but I don&#x27;t really see any other way to create the dream sci-fi robot assistant. It has to be able to do things as you, and it would be impossible to manually integrate with every website or service.
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tapoxi超过 1 年前
It&#x27;s a neat idea but I&#x27;m not sure what the audience is. &quot;It&#x27;s simpler&quot;, but you still need to manage a bunch of integrations from a computer? It can&#x27;t seem to make phone calls?<p>I just want something that I can give my 93 year old grandfather so he can order a ride and get reminders about his prescriptions. Rabbit seems like a device that misses an audience that actually needs a simpler smartphone.
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popey超过 1 年前
Heh, Rabbit (another one) was a location-specific mobile phone company in the UK back in the early 1990&#x27;s. You had to be near an antenna to make or receive a call. It&#x27;s the first thing that came to mind when this post came up.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Rabbit_(telecommunications)" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Rabbit_(telecommunications)</a>
theogravity超过 1 年前
Not sure why they felt they needed their own hardware for this. They could have built it for multiple platforms to get more traction &#x2F; usage.
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rsolva超过 1 年前
That Teenage Engineering is collaborating on this makes this a very interesting device. But I would not call it a phone? A pocket assistant maybe?
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tptacek超过 1 年前
This seems like one of the least expensive things Teenage Engineering has done.
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gmuslera超过 1 年前
The future is now. At least the 5 next minutes, but then it will keep changing and what you do with an intended expire time of at least a year will be badly obsolete and moldy in a month.<p>That is the problem doing end user hardware tied to a technology that is changing very fast and where most of the innovation may be out of your sight, being carried by your main competitors.
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freediver超过 1 年前
One of the most impressive product launches I&#x27;ve seen recently. Looks almost too good to be true. Good luck to the team.
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nderjung超过 1 年前
The biggest take away from this is the LAM-over-email which was hidden away in one of the demos. This has a lot more potential (esp. in a business context) in my opinion than the phone itself.<p>Being able to directly email an autonomous agent or even CC one later into a conversation with instructions can be a game-changer. Not only would the replies be faster but the result could be cheaper compared to a human equivalent.<p>One use case which comes to mind is, which was also demo&#x27;d, is making trip arrangements. In the demo, the spoken request to book a trip to London was long and precise; no way I would get that right the first time on any push-to-talk device. At my company, we use a travel agent for business trips which we email and they book everything and send over receipts and tickets. I could just as well be emailing a LLM&#x2F;LAM.
TheCleric超过 1 年前
This is never going to work for me because I don’t want to talk to my computer. When I’m in public my voice is noise pollution at best and is telling everyone around me what I’m doing at worst.<p>Call me weird but I don’t want everyone around me essentially hearing every thought I’m looking up in real time. Feels creepy.
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ark4n超过 1 年前
Most people won&#x27;t want to carry multiple devices, and I doubt people will sacrifice their existing phone.<p>When Apple implement something remotely similar to this into iOS (WWDC this year, anyone?), it will likely render products like this obsolete.<p>Honourable mention, Teenage Engineering crushing it with the hardware, as usual.
furyofantares超过 1 年前
I&#x27;d totally buy a ChatGPT+ device for my 7yo and I imagine people around the house would use it quite a bit.<p>Not sure I want to replace any other actions yet. Probably someday, but touch + apps is actually just incredibly good. A sub-1yo can start learning to use a smartphone &#x2F; ipad, and a 6yo can put together an uber eats order. I&#x27;m not saying it can&#x27;t be improved on, and I fully want a competent voice assistant in my phone. But it&#x27;s gonna be real hard to do better than what we already have in our pockets on the things they&#x27;re already good at.<p>So this presentation fell flat is for me are when it was talking about doing things pretty much everyone does just fine on their phone. But it was very exciting to imagine a ChatGPT+ device sitting around the house for anyone to pick up and interact with.
paweladamczuk超过 1 年前
&gt; LAM completes these tasks for you on virtual environments in our cloud<p>&gt; no subscription required<p>This does not compute for me.
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dhumph超过 1 年前
I don&#x27;t know about others, but I don&#x27;t want something else to carry in my pocket.. especially something that duplicates what i can already do, just in a different way.<p>seems like it&#x27;s connecting to external services but i&#x27;m not sure why siri couldn&#x27;t do that.
VickWildman超过 1 年前
The website and the first 5 minutes of the keynote fails to convey what the device does exactly, other than that it meant to replace smartphones, which can&#x27;t be right. This form factor would be inconvenient for watching videos and that&#x27;s one of the most common uses of smartphones. They should just market it as a pocket assistant and make it do one thing exceptionally well. It&#x27;s a losing strategy to try to be everything for everyone instead of just trying to dominate a small beachhead market. Smartphones with better assistants are coming, but there is no reason to compete with them. Just differentiate the damn product.
endofreach超过 1 年前
How do companies like this get funding? Do they get it before even having a prototype?
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computerliker超过 1 年前
The device itself is really cute. I&#x27;m not sure about handing oauth tokens to all my accounts to a third party for them to run huginn&#x2F;selenium on a backend that might not be online for more than a year. I&#x27;m barely comfortable with Alexa having a connection to my iTunes for podcasts. What happens when Uber or whoever decides to throw a captcha between Rabbit and the web frontend?<p>I&#x27;d like to see it do more than help me buy things. Teach mode seems to be the main way to do productivity tasks?<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;huginn&#x2F;huginn">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;huginn&#x2F;huginn</a>
supafastcoder超过 1 年前
These demos are always the same: “&lt;Product&gt; find me the closest pizza”<p>Who actually interacts with a device like that? Is it an important problem enough to be paying $199 while I can do the same thing (often even better) with my phone?
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YarickR2超过 1 年前
&gt;the future of human-machine interface<p>No. I could go deep into &quot;rare language, weird slang, local dialect&quot; hole, but simple &quot;No&quot; would be enough. Their website is exceedingly non user-friendly, too
nycticorax超过 1 年前
Can someone who has watched the keynote tell me what this device is for?
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nabakin超过 1 年前
I can&#x27;t see this product outcompeting Apple, Google, Samsung, etc. At best, if it gets enough interest, it will be copied and improved like what happened with Pebble and smart watches
tamimio超过 1 年前
&gt; rabbit OS operates apps on our secured cloud, so you don’t have to<p>Absolutely Not!
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lbotos超过 1 年前
This is HN... so what OS do we think this is running? Android under the hood? Anyone know more about hardware or screen res?<p>I wonder how hard it would be to root this device and use it for the hardware.
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pmelendez超过 1 年前
I am definitely not the target audience for this. I am that person that keeps typing while people send voice notes, and now the only way to interact with this device is via voice? :(
uni_baconcat超过 1 年前
LLM-first phone, but LLM not run locally? I can&#x27;t accept that.
mondobe超过 1 年前
Haven&#x27;t seen anyone mention just how bad the website design is here. The homepage ran at single-digit FPS on my (pretty powerful) laptop, and I noticed performance hits where there really shouldn&#x27;t have been.<p>Besides that, there are too many animations where a few sentences or pictures would do. Elsewhere, thick walls of text, sometimes barely indistinguishable in color from the background.<p>The site seems to be an omen of the product itself: cool in concept, but touch-and-go in implementation.
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rmah超过 1 年前
I can&#x27;t even tell what that gadget is for. I can&#x27;t tell what it does. There is nothing about what it can do for me (or anyone for that matter).
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yungporko超过 1 年前
if TE are selling it for $200, it must only be worth $20.
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80scyborgninja超过 1 年前
<a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=a2h-Hl3lewg" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=a2h-Hl3lewg</a>
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zyang超过 1 年前
Does the LLM run on device or in cloud. Can&#x27;t find any info on the website but I assume device that size everything runs in the backend?
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rabbit-vibrator超过 1 年前
The website - looks like its trying to emualte apple. The key note = The speakers hand movements and gestures are funny, emualting apple again. The demo of the device, faked. Funny - When it switches cameras back to the guy holding the device and hes just nodding, looks totally fake...<p>all in all.. fake and trying to copy apple. Can&#x27;t people be original anymore?<p>Is this an early April fools?
krazydad超过 1 年前
The most troublesome part of this demo for me was the one tablespoon of mayo it wanted you to add to your vegetable omelet. Yikes.
mhuesler超过 1 年前
The AI first OS is a step in the right direction. I just don&#x27;t think that a new device in this format is necessary yet. Regardless - I&#x27;m missing visual feedback in the current version. It&#x27;s too open-ended so a list of suggestions on what to do would be helpful for example. Overall pretty cool MVP tho. Excited to see what&#x27;s next!
rfwhyte超过 1 年前
Without a complete accounting of this companies ties to the CCP, there&#x27;s literally ZERO chance I&#x27;d ever use their man in the middle attack vector device. Giving all my most sensitive login credentials to a Chinese company that&#x27;s trying very hard not to be seen as a Chinese company seems like a totally sane and safe thing to do...
airstrike超过 1 年前
Interesting idea, kudos. Definitely advances the conversation, even if it doesn&#x27;t ultimately emerge as the winner
kuter超过 1 年前
Few points:<p>- Not sure if people would want to &quot;talk to&quot; a device in public.<p>- Anything and more that this device do can be done by a smart phone that people already have.<p>- I feel like people prefer using a UI interface instead of speech.An example to this behavior might be using delivery apps instead of calling a restaurant.<p>- Looks too wide to fit into most pockets.
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fxd123超过 1 年前
This keynote really makes it seem like a scam. For example the &quot;plan travel&quot; section hardly shows anything. He just says &quot;It&#x27;s all been planned out, I just confirm, confirm, confirm...&quot;- while the camera cuts to him tapping the device without showing <i>anything</i> on the screen.
Krasnol超过 1 年前
I&#x27;d buy that for my elderly parents who are overwhelmed with apps.<p>Probably not the first model but the next one for sure if it can text and phone too.<p>I think there is a market for this and even though I despise talking to a device, I can see the use and I can see how it could bridge a world which is getting too complicated.
yzydserd超过 1 年前
I store the playdate in one sock. I can store this in the paired sock for a few hours of light per year.
v9v超过 1 年前
I&#x27;m curious how they plan on covering the cost of their cloud services without a subscription fee.
sebramirez超过 1 年前
I genuinely think this tech is really cool for old or disabled people who can all of a sudden interface with their devices with just natural language, that said I legitimately just do not see the appeal for regular users but cool tech nonetheless.
everythingctl超过 1 年前
Has any startup succeeded by starting out offering shiny hardware running innovative new software, all of which they have to develop?<p>It seems like a fatal dilution of focus to have to worry about the design and logistics of a fancy dumb terminal widget when you also have to get the software&#x2F;AI&#x2F;app integration stuff right.<p>Just make an app with text and voice interaction. Accept that the thing in our pockets with a screen and an internet connection is going to be a smartphone. You will not build an own-hardware moat with these weird little bits of e-waste.
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taytus超过 1 年前
Why did they turn off comments on their YouTube video?<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=22wlLy7hKP4&amp;ab_channel=rabbit" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=22wlLy7hKP4&amp;ab_channel=rabbi...</a><p>This smells fishy.
rufusthedogwoof超过 1 年前
I feel like we could do this on a steam deck with docker, ollama, mistral, and crewai.<p>push a button and talk to the ear buds.<p>On wifi at least. without a camera.<p>Not sure if any models are trained with app screenshots and interactions quite yet though. Shouldn&#x27;t be long.
alabhyajindal超过 1 年前
Not having a subscription is shocking. I really like the device and LAM sounds promising. I just don&#x27;t see how they are going to make money offering unlimited LLM + LAM capabilities without a subscription service.
mschwarz超过 1 年前
I want this to be legit, but I fear we’ve entered the ICO phase of the AI boom
serf超过 1 年前
the keynote failed me at &quot;Shake the device to create a keyboard on the screen&quot;.<p>if the whole damn point of suffering with your goofy wildly colored mostly-incompatible mobile device is a talkable LLM, then &quot;shake to keyboard&quot; is a failure.<p>at $200 i&#x27;d rather just buy any of the plethora of sbc mini devices with cell phone antennas and play with LLMs myself without the black box that I can&#x27;t touch. a uconsole or similar is , generally speaking, cheaper AND open-ish -- it&#x27;s a fool&#x27;s errand to trust a non-paid subscription service to continue existing.
ramoz超过 1 年前
The biggest competitor to Apple and google is ChatGPT.<p>The future of manual human interactions is certainly limited. (It will definitely end up looking like movie Her).<p>OpenAI is in best position to redefine the edge OS’s that get us there.
elliotpage超过 1 年前
I scrolled the webste twice but I cannot figure out what this object is for?
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rburhum超过 1 年前
Sidenote: I find it funny that somebody that is trying to create a product that competes with Apple and Google ends up showing both of their logos in many places of their most important marketing video.
rcarmo超过 1 年前
If Siri worked like this, it would have fulfilled its intended purpose.
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andy_ppp超过 1 年前
Yes, of course a hardware startup have a better product than Open AI. Definitely not an entirely faked demo… my suggestion is that this will not happen for 5 years at least.
pizzafeelsright超过 1 年前
<i>No one, including us, will be able to use personally identifiable information (your name, phone number, email address, etc.) for any purpose other than serving you.</i><p>Has some CPP vibes.
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hauget超过 1 年前
I hope they succeed. Would buy this if it worked offline. Wish Pebble hadn&#x27;t gone broke and had launched their Pebble Core device. Always thought it was a great idea.
ojbyrne超过 1 年前
I was going to spend some time criticizing&#x2F;ridiculing this (&quot;analog scroll wheel&quot; in the feature list made me lol) but then I saw the price. $200? Maybe.
anentropic超过 1 年前
Haven&#x27;t watched the keynote yet, but this looks approx what I thought at beginning of last year Apple should have been building instead of Vision Pro
unnouinceput超过 1 年前
Quote: &quot;Pre-order now&quot;.<p>Just like for games, &quot;no, I don&#x27;t think I will&quot;. I&#x27;ll let the quirks be ironed first then I&#x27;ll see the reviews.
realo超过 1 年前
Nowadays we don&#x27;t really buy hardware or software... We buy into ecosystems.<p>The Android crowd, the Apple gang, etc... Once you are member of one ecosystem, friction is high enough usually to keep you in.<p>Moreover, many of the eco-customers wear more than one device.. phone, watch ...<p>So... why would I buy into yet another ecosystem with a third device to carry?<p>And no... most eco-clients will not abandon their current ecosystem that easily.<p>The 360 degree camera is quite nice, though...
jadengeller超过 1 年前
I&#x27;ll admit the device is very cute, but without a solution to prompt injection, you&#x27;d be a fool to give this access to your accounts.
lgleason超过 1 年前
Feels like this is a natural effect of peak AI hype.
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jareklupinski超过 1 年前
watching the keynote, I was about to click Buy until I saw all the steps that required a laptop...<p>i feel a revolution shouldnt require so much tethering to other services through the hardware you are looking to replace?<p>if they keep iterating towards a truly standalone product, I think they&#x27;ll hit all the notes we&#x27;ve been waiting for from a post-cellphone portable device<p>or can I make an AI agent to set it up for me :)
akraut超过 1 年前
FYI: Anyone that decides to throw down just to see when the hardware comes out, the return policy is 14 days after money changes hands
qwertox超过 1 年前
I&#x27;d prefer it as an app. I already have the hardware and there&#x27;d be no need for an additional card in the data plan.
crotchfire超过 1 年前
Please enable JavaScript to view this website
angryasian超过 1 年前
Its interesting but not all apps or services offer integrations. You still have a problem with oauth and logging in.
cedws超过 1 年前
I can&#x27;t tell if it&#x27;s tongue-in-cheek but the keynote is extremely similar to the first iPhone keynote.
srirach超过 1 年前
That orange was incredibly hard on my eyes
ChrisArchitect超过 1 年前
What is the backstory of Rabbit?<p>They had to get Jesse to do this keynote with his arms in the air the whole time?
huy77超过 1 年前
I am convinced that this company is 1-man standing. The man made this whole thing up himself.
mt_超过 1 年前
Innovation for e-waste rennovation.
polishdude20超过 1 年前
What&#x27;s a &quot;far field mic&quot;? You mean a microphone? Like what all phones have?
bluecrab超过 1 年前
If it&#x27;s relying on the cloud then you&#x27;re better off using an app on your phone.
Quinzel超过 1 年前
The actual device looks like the kind of toy smart phone you give a toddler for their toy box, and I genuinely don’t see a need for a new device.<p>The AI in the device could be installed on any smartphone surely?<p>Are they pitching the device to try and make their product seem more tangible and get buy-in from more people?
etoxin超过 1 年前
Appears that only people from the northern hemisphere can order this, Shame.
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genman超过 1 年前
What ever it is but this website is completely unusable on Firefox.
htrp超过 1 年前
Isn&#x27;t Gemini nano being integrated into all of the new pixels?
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lamfm95超过 1 年前
It feels like a gimmick to me. The response speed is just too slow
huhtenberg超过 1 年前
Weird, no media gets loaded on the site if the uBlock is on.
ChrisArchitect超过 1 年前
Looks alot like a play.date?<p>Think I had forgotten TE did the design for that
pbronez超过 1 年前
Neat idea, worth a try. Privacy story will be interesting.
unknown2342超过 1 年前
very inspiring. I like to primitive UX things: the scroll wheel and the turning camera and the button. If I had 200 bucks for fun, I would spend them.
ShamelessC超过 1 年前
That rotating camera seems doomed to break easily.
barrenko超过 1 年前
Can it make calls?
mjhagen超过 1 年前
The pitch video makes me think of General Magic.
sergiotapia超过 1 年前
Small enough that I would carry it in my shirt pocket or back pocket for anything. Looks very slick and at a very good price. Will buy three for my siblings this christmas.
brcmthrowaway超过 1 年前
How does this compare to the Humane device?
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karmakaze超过 1 年前
Why does this have to be a competing device? It can do it all on a web page. For that matter put it <i>all</i> in a watch and lose the smartphone.
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eurekin超过 1 年前
Theranos resemblance is off the charts
wangii超过 1 年前
great, the new OS war is coming! the question is, who gets the network effect bottle neck right?
qainsights超过 1 年前
Is it using OpenAI under the hood?
z61a超过 1 年前
seems too good to be true. Uber, doordash, and travel planning are too fast to be true...
DrNosferatu超过 1 年前
It’s the wrong form format:<p>- It should be a Smart Watch!<p>(or smart glasses, perhaps later)<p>With a companion web dashboard to be used from the user’s smartphone, tablet or PC.
nextworddev超过 1 年前
Looks like vaporware to me
xvector超过 1 年前
This may just be the shittiest product website I&#x27;ve ever seen. It conveys absolutely nothing of value about the product. What problem does it solve?<p>It&#x27;s just &quot;ooh, pretty pictures, buttons and camera.&quot; Seriously? I&#x27;m supposed to trust a product from a company that can&#x27;t even tell me what it&#x27;s about without making me sit through a 25-minute keynote? Are they out of their minds?
scblock超过 1 年前
How can you so badly fail at even saying what the hell this is on your shitty glossy web site? What is this? The page is just a list of hardware &#x27;features&#x27; with large but unclear pictures.<p>&quot;push to talk button&quot; ok, so?<p>&quot;far-field mike&quot; ok, so?<p>&quot;360 degree rotational eye&quot; so what?<p>&quot;analog scroll wheel&quot; that does what?<p>&quot;usb-c plus sim card slot&quot; which gives me what?<p>There&#x27;s a video but I shouldn&#x27;t have to watch a video.
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zombiwoof超过 1 年前
imagine everyone in the airport lounge all with these.
Dwanesr超过 1 年前
Who is Arthur Ashe
chernoby超过 1 年前
i confused, why don&#x27;t you just create an app
WesolyKubeczek超过 1 年前
To summarize, it’s a pocket piece of e-waste.
nipponese超过 1 年前
Hiding the screen during the ticket purchase userflow&#x2F;UI at 15:20 is laughable.
gandalfthepink超过 1 年前
meh!
infotainment超过 1 年前
As usual with Teenage Engineering, I love the hardware design, but this aspect of the software is a letdown:<p><i>&gt; rabbit OS operates apps on our secured cloud, so you don’t have to. Log into the apps you’d like rabbit to use on your system through the rabbit hole to relay control. You only need to do this once per app.</i><p>So things don&#x27;t run on the device, but on the cloud. Unfortunate.
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BoppreH超过 1 年前
The keynote is near science fiction, but the actual implementation is leaving me badly confused.<p>- Did it really scan the whole table to add a new column? As in, OCR? What would happen if I had more than one screenful of data, and who in their right mind would trust the OCR&#x27;ed output?<p>- How can it access the Discord account for the &quot;teach mode&quot;? Is it stealing your (sensitive and expiring!) cookies to reproduce the actions on their cloud? Or worse yet, running instructions from the AI on your local machine?<p>- It shows structured results from Spotify and Uber on the r1&#x27;s screen. Does it have custom integration with all those apps? What happens when the API changes (Twitter), or they don&#x27;t support an app I need (local taxi), or the app is averse to third-party integration (WhatsApp), or I need an &quot;advanced&quot; feature (payment methods on Uber)?<p>- Why in the VC hell are they basing their revenue on a one-time sale of a clearly unnecessary electronic gadget (my phone already has all that!), when their biggest variable costs will be recurring cloud expenses?
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plasticbugs超过 1 年前
It&#x27;s a striking condemnation of the current state of things that my $1K+ mobile phone does not do anything close to what&#x27;s in this demo. I would pay $200 just to have a voice assistant that isn&#x27;t totally incapable of playing songs requested like &quot;Play SONG_TITLE from ALBUM_TITLE&quot;.<p>As an example, yesterday my daughter asked for a song from Snow White.<p>EDITED FOR CORRECTNESS (originally I said I asked for Heigh Ho from Cinderella)<p>In the car I say, &quot;Hey Siri, play Heigh Ho from the Snow White Soundtrack&quot;. Siri: &quot;Sure, here&#x27;s Snow (Hey Oh) by Red Hot Chili Peppers&quot; (try it yourself!)<p>Why are Alexa and Siri still so useless, inaccurate and inconsistent? Why can&#x27;t I yet ask Siri to &quot;book me a ride via Uber from location X to location Y&quot; or &quot;reorder the same thing I got last Tuesday from Uber Eats&quot;? I assume it&#x27;s down to compute costs, but I would absolutely pay an additional subscription fee for more intelligence behind these voice assistants.
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crubier超过 1 年前
I have no idea whatsoever about what this device is doing but I&#x27;m pretty sure it should have been just a mobile app
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Sirikon超过 1 年前
Giving your credentials to an AI to buy stuff online by scraping a web interface is a perfectly sane and safe idea that won&#x27;t have any unexpected consequences whatsoever.
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underyx超过 1 年前
Two things in the keynote that seem faked:<p>1. at 13:13 there&#x27;s a demo ordering a ride &#x27;to home&#x27;, then the user requests a car change to fit six people, and what&#x27;s shown as a seamless switch from UberX to UberXL also updates the destination from the home address to LAX airport.<p>2. at 14:05 the device confirms and recites a pizza order, but the screen displays &quot;chesse&quot; with a typo while the voice reads out &quot;cheese&quot;, so either the audio or the visuals is faked. My guess is that all of the on-device graphics were hand-written and hand-animated which would explain both mistakes.<p>I stopped watching at that point. Am sort of sad to see Teenage Engineering associated with a product that seems so sloppy and&#x2F;or shady.
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trunnell超过 1 年前
Red flags:<p>1) Price seems too low for unlimited LLM usage and there&#x27;s no monthly fee... so maybe you are the product?<p>2) Website has no information on the people behind this.<p>3) In the keynote, the demo of logging into to other services like Spotify appears to just be stealing the auth tokens from the laptop and shipping them to the R1 device. Not a good sign.<p>4) The founder&#x27;s voice-over insists that &quot;we value privacy&quot; and &quot;we do not hack&quot; and &quot;we do not create fake users.&quot; Protests too much?<p>5) They&#x27;re not really addressing the trust-building necessary to convince people to use this like a personal assistant. It&#x27;s waaaay too opaque.<p>Neat product, though. Maybe they&#x27;re just launching super early, nothing is figured out yet, the website isn&#x27;t done, etc.
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starkparker超过 1 年前
<a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.rabbit.tech&#x2F;rabbit-os" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.rabbit.tech&#x2F;rabbit-os</a>:<p>&gt; Record your actions, explain them with your voice, and play them to rabbit OS. LAM will learn the nuances and create a rabbit that can be applied to various scenarios.<p>&gt; What if you create a rabbit that could be useful to others? You can monetize and distribute it on our upcoming rabbit store.<p>This is neat right up until &quot;monetize&quot;, where everything flips from being a potentially cool community group of reproducible actions, to a pile of spam and bot-generated bullshit
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pixelpoet超过 1 年前
The &quot;keynote&quot; (is that what we&#x27;re calling advertising videos now?) was pretty awful, and I&#x27;m unconvinced that making people unable to even use smartphones (which has already supplanted computer literacy for most) is progress.<p>Extra negative taste points for wanting a &quot;cool SUV&quot; for a trip to London.
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alkonaut超过 1 年前
I&#x27;m not talking to computers still. It&#x27;s a border I just can&#x27;t cross. Like I&#x27;d literally rather stop and type on my car display than try to voice in a destination. And I&#x27;d if I&#x27;m cooking and my hands are greasy wash my hands and pick up my phone and tap in a timer for 5 minutes rather than try some &quot;set timer for 5 minutes&quot; voice command. Not sure I ever will start talking to computers, but not this year at least. Anyone else feel the same way? It&#x27;s part because in public it feels extremely dumb. But mostly I think it&#x27;s the frustration. At least fumbling on touchscreen characters is a known frustration. Trying to voice-in a Scandinavian street name is worse.
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gaoryrt超过 1 年前
He is the founder of RavenTech. Baidu acquired RavenTech and he became the leader of Baidu&#x27;s smart hardware division, and then launched the Raven H, which you may have heard of.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.theverge.com&#x2F;circuitbreaker&#x2F;2017&#x2F;11&#x2F;16&#x2F;16664846&#x2F;teenage-engineering-h-smart-speaker-r-robot-arm" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.theverge.com&#x2F;circuitbreaker&#x2F;2017&#x2F;11&#x2F;16&#x2F;16664846&#x2F;...</a>
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PostOnce超过 1 年前
A weird cellphone that runs everything from the cloud?<p>There&#x27;s no way this isn&#x27;t a nonfunctional brick in 18-36 months when they go bust.
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ergocoder超过 1 年前
I&#x27;ll call it. This is vaporware. This is similar to Fast and Bolt.<p>2 reasons:<p>- It will be better as a phone. People will not use it and the initial hype will die quickly.<p>- It is seemingly useful but useless in practice because many things are impossible to do. The demo is already so fake.<p>With the two above reasons, the momentum and funding will dry up quickly.<p>Check back in a year.
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drcongo超过 1 年前
I thought this was going to be a Teenage Engineering sex toy and I&#x27;m slightly disappointed that it isn&#x27;t.
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tracyhenry超过 1 年前
My hot take:<p>ALL AI wearable companies should return their money to investors, and wait for the AR glasses by Apple.<p>AR glasses are the ultimate form factor. And as much as I hate monopoly, Apple has the right app&#x2F;dev ecosystem, and will make Siri work.
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squarefoot超过 1 年前
This is pretty much what everyone saw coming when LLM became a reality: that is, eliminating the usual human-machine interface because now the machine can understand what we say and instructing it through keypresses and clicks becomes unnecessary. In a few years everyone will carry a device like this one, and &quot;call Jim, the one I met the other day, not my brother&quot; or &quot;start writing an email to all my associates&quot; etc. will become a reality, and visual interfaces will be relegated to contexts where we actually want visual interaction, such as photos, movies, games, etc. All cool, but unfortunately there&#x27;s a catch: a device that can run AI locally and connect to the Internet without depending on a proprietary cloud, as of today can&#x27;t fit in a pocket and can&#x27;t cost $199, therefore it will depend on services that will have a cost in money and privacy. Also, since this is looks like nothing more than an audio&#x2F;video interface to a remote cloud AI, everything it does can be replicated on a smartphone app.
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