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Show HN: Linen.team – A lightweight, thread-first Slack alternative

124 点作者 cheeseblubber大约 1 年前
Hi HN! I&#x27;m Kam, the founder and one of the authors of Linen. Today, we are launching Linen.team (<a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;linen.team&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;linen.team&#x2F;</a>), a lightweight threaded messaging app for your team.<p>Modern workplace messaging apps (like Slack) are based on IRC, which is great for small groups, but as it scales, breaks down quickly: you either get overwhelmed by notifications or you have to turn them all off. Most chat apps have threads tacked on but aren&#x27;t built from the ground up with this design in mind. We wanted to create a thread-first experience where you can organize and prioritize conversations so that you are not reliant on notifications to make sure you don’t miss anything.<p>In apps like Slack, you have to check activities, channels, threads, and replies just to make sure you aren&#x27;t missing anything important. We designed every message in Linen to belong to a thread, so it makes it easy to centralize everything in a single location. We let you select which channels you subscribe to from your inbox. This way, your inbox only has the important channels. This makes it easy to keep track of conversations without having to rely on notifications to make sure you don’t miss anything.<p>We also wanted a better way to separate urgent vs. non-urgent communication. In Linen, we have introduced the concept of a !mention that is designed for urgent&#x2F;time-sensitive messages. A !mention will send a push notification, whereas an @mention will show up in the person’s inbox. This allows us to encourage more async conversations and reduce the need for the number of push notifications. We also designed the mention system closely with the inbox so that even if you aren’t subscribed to channels, mentions will still appear in your inbox. This is great for joining partner teams where you don’t need to view every conversation but do need to respond when you are mentioned.<p>We believe that most messaging apps are secretly to-do lists in disguise; you have to read, respond, or do some task when you receive a thread. We wanted to give you the ability to manage threads individually. We let you mark each thread as done, which hides them from your inbox and is useful to keep track of tasks. You also can set reminders and mute threads with one click&#x2F;key. With these features, we make it easy to get to a zero inbox state. This combined with the inbox makes it easy for you to keep track of conversations and make sure you don’t miss anything.<p>Linen is designed for power users. We love keyboard shortcuts and want an experience that is keyboard-first. For many, the messaging app is the app that is used the most. We believe that you should be able to use Linen for an entire day without touching the mouse. We’ve added modern features like CMD+K for navigation. We’ve designed Linen to be fast and lightweight. Our gzipped bundle size is 400KB, so it&#x27;s fast on first load, and we’ve introduced multiple layers of caching to make sure things are fast on subsequent loads.<p>We’ve been working hard on this app for the past 6 months, so there are still gaps in the platform. But we’re also very excited about the direction we can take. Our focus is on what a modern message platform built in 2024 should look like and what lessons we can take from the previous decades of IRC and messaging apps. If our message resonates with you, we would love for you to give us a try at <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.linen.team&#x2F;signup?callbackUrl=%2Flinen" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.linen.team&#x2F;signup?callbackUrl=%2Flinen</a>, where you can join our public community and come say hi!

24 条评论

apimade大约 1 年前
If this is just a replacement chat tool, it&#x27;s fine - and a great start.<p>But if you want to replace Slack, you need to focus on the developer community and third-party integrations right now. We&#x27;re not paying for something that only gives us &quot;just&quot; chat with better-by-design UX and chat workflows. Teams is free and fits this purpose, at least in the eyes of an executive.<p>Slack&#x27;s developer environment (outside of Grid features, the new &quot;Premium Workflows&quot; and &quot;Next Generation Platform&quot;) is first-class.<p>At the very least start with some webhook integrations.<p>Also your Privacy Policy has no mention of Amazon Web Services, I think you might want to review your &quot;DATA PROCESSORS &#x2F; SERVICE PROVIDERS&quot; section.<p>Also, are you planning on offering single-tenant options? Not a fan of our chat data sitting with a bunch of other organisations.
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cheeseblubber大约 1 年前
Some technical notes: This is actually a fork of Linen.dev, an SEO-friendly Slack alternative for communities. We originally built Linen.dev with Next.js but ultimately found it quite limiting when we wanted to make things fast and responsive and have custom caches. For Linen.team, there wasn’t a need for server rendering since we didn’t need our product to be SEO-friendly. We removed Next.js and replaced it with Vite and Express, which simplified our code quite a bit since we didn’t have the legacy requirements. We also spent quite a bit of time optimizing the performance and query so that it is much faster than the previous version of Linen. Our plan is to open source Linen.team as well; we need to do some repo clean-up first.<p>Finally, after a year, we actually reduced our client bundle size from 500kb to less than 400kb. You can see our post on bundle optimization here: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=35718417">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=35718417</a>.
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llamaLord大约 1 年前
To be clear, this is not a dig, but I love that we&#x27;re basically coming full-circle back to email, just without any of the decentralization and inter-tennant interoperability that comes natively to email.<p>All we need now is for someone to give every Linen user an externally accessible handle that allows cross-tenant invites or &#x27;thread sharing&#x27; and we&#x27;ll have officially closed the loop.
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jonathaneunice大约 1 年前
&gt; We believe that most messaging apps are secretly to-do lists in disguise; you have to read, respond, or do some task when you receive a thread.<p>Perfect observation. Thank you for focusing on this reality. They aren&#x27;t benign messages; they&#x27;re summons, pleas, assignments, and to-dos.
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arcza大约 1 年前
Another small suggestion - 14 days seems way too short for a trial; most SaaS trials are 30 and I often end up emailing for extensions before onboarding a new vendor. This is not a cost skimp, it&#x27;s to avoid making the wrong decision.
stavros大约 1 年前
How does Linen compare to Zulip?
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sgarland大约 1 年前
&gt; 400 KB<p>Can&#x2F;will you maintain this devotion to optimization when shipping a a desktop client? If it could not be Electron, that would be great.<p>I love the differentiation between ! and @. There are many times when I want to inform a group without bothering them.
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arcza大约 1 年前
Can this be self managed? Major plus if so.<p>Not everyone goes to the cloud by default. There are many orgs out there that want full data sovereignty for better infosec without relying on someone else&#x27;s servers.
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perryraskin大约 1 年前
Ever hear about Levels by Derrick Reimer? Seems like this is trying to accomplish the same thing. He eventually shut it down though. Looks like you got YC funding though so that’s huge!
jqpabc123大约 1 年前
Pricing is a tricky endeavor but personal opinion --- $9 per user per month is a little excessive just for messaging compared to the competition.
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wlll大约 1 年前
&gt; threaded messaging app<p>I hated threads in slack when they were introduced. However, as with a lot of things (new site designs etc) it helps to give them time to settle in before you decide if you really like them or not and I&#x27;m happy to report that now after several years have passed since they were introduced I still absolutely <i>hate</i> slack threads.<p>They are one of the worst parts of slack. They are where information goes to die, they are easily missed, they are cumbersome to deal with. I would disable them if I could.<p>Perhaps they work well with huge teams, but I&#x27;ve worked in companies with tens and hundreds of engineers and they have been an unecessary hindrance.
Aeolun大约 1 年前
This looks really nice. It’s similar to Slack, but still has it’s own distinctive feel.
krageon大约 1 年前
The ways in which slack is different from IRC are it&#x27;s worst features, as a developer. The fact that you&#x27;ve told us that you&#x27;re focusing on what makes it most different from IRC is not encouraging.
memset大约 1 年前
Awesome! I’ve been desperately looking for a slack alternative. In part I want something more lightweight, and nowadays there are so many little upsells that get in the way.<p>My biggest use case is talking to people on other teams (Slack Connect.) How is that managed here?<p>Also, what is the narrative around adding users and billing? I hate that every time I add someone to slack for a project need to make a buying decision (are they a full user, guest user, active vs inactive…) Is it possible to pay for users when they’re active, and not have to worry about managing seats when projects end?
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dandigangi大约 1 年前
Going to check this out for funzies. I do love Slack threads but not something you can force. Discord threads have much to be desired in their UX&#x2F;UI. My least &quot;favorite&quot; of theirs in fact. Losing the colocation of information is extremely negative impacting to an organization.<p>Slack&#x27;s UI with activity and all that went down significantly from their latest update. Shocked they haven&#x27;t switched back. Community feedback from what I gathered is extremely unhappy users.
Aeolun大约 1 年前
When I sign up it asks me for a display name, but after I sign up it has completely ignored that and instead added the part before the @ in my email address.
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dcsan大约 1 年前
Any reason you&#x27;re using rest for a chat client? Maybe socket scaling limitations of the node&#x2F;express stack. Not as bad as php whci slack is still mostly written in, but hard to beat the mostly Erlang stack for discord. It also makes it&#x27;s lot easier for bot dev having a two way connection without the hassle of ngrok etc.
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byyll大约 1 年前
Very interesting, I was looking for a lightweight team collaboration tool yesterday. I like ClickUp&#x2F;Wrike&#x2F;etc. but even their home page feels slow, before signing up.<p>I wonder if there are any alternatives to you and how you compare to them.
ohghiZai大约 1 年前
Is there a way for automations to post messages with web hooks? That&#x27;s usually the easiest automation-type feature to implement on the platform and for users
iimblack大约 1 年前
Any tests done on scaling? How’s the search? Maybe because of the nature of slack but I use advanced filters very frequently to find old messages.
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smallerfish大约 1 年前
How do you distinguish your product from Twist? I like the two levels of mentions, but that&#x27;s not enough to convince me to jump by itself.
mark336大约 1 年前
Here is Mix0r, a thread-first &quot;Messageboard for Anything&quot; type site: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.willashani.com&#x2F;gigabots&#x2F;db" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.willashani.com&#x2F;gigabots&#x2F;db</a>. I built it because I wanted to use a site like Twitter but with messageboard-like threads. I also believe that every post belongs to a thread so it can be easily referred to. And I too, think think that a thread-based app can be used like a todo-list. I have some examples there.
hwbehrens大约 1 年前
Do you have any plans to release a desktop-compatible bundle?
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snotrockets大约 1 年前
I have no words to describe how bad is the ! and @ distinctions: it means you give control of your notification to other people. I can see it abused 100 different ways (and if you do build for large teams, and don&#x27;t expect abuse, then you&#x27;re either never been on any large enough service, or never talked with anyone in a minority group).
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