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SecondLife Didn't Fail

134 点作者 spatten将近 13 年前

24 条评论

danilocampos将近 13 年前
The first code I ever wrote, I wrote in Second Life.<p>The first interface I ever designed was for a HUD I built for the robot avatar I wanted to sell in Second Life.<p>The first time I ever heard the names Neal Stephenson or Charles Stross, it was in Second Life.<p>The first time I ever paid my rent based on work I had done entirely for and by myself, it was from selling hundreds of robots in Second Life.<p>I was 19. It was magic.<p>There's a substantial part of what I am today that I could not have become without what I learned from Second Life.<p>Yes, the developer tools are awful and the laggy experience can kill a lot of the fun. But fuck – I was selling killer robots to people and getting paid for it in what could become real money, somehow. Because that's how I wanted to use it. And it let me do all of that? Incredible.
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codered1200将近 13 年前
I've been a Second Life player for about six years now, and there isn't a lot of crossover between the audiences of SL and here, so I thought I'd weigh in on the 'success' of the game.<p>Originally there was a a huge amount of hype about the idea of real world businesses opening up an SL presence as something of a "new frontier", as well as vistualised museums, art exhibits, music shows and so on, but these for the most part never got off the ground.<p>Second Life generally has two sides; the first is an incredibly commercialist (to the point of being fetishistic) sector, where the players that prefer to treat SL as a kind of gigantic virtual dollset can buy clothing, hair, skins etc for their avatars, and has the same kind of draw as The Sims games, except this is real money we're talking about. This in itself gives one type of businesses at least a good way to generate income; 3D content creators.<p>The other side of SL are the very large groups of people that play the game to indulge in some sort of alternative fantasy. There are massive populations of furries, Goreans, BDSM practitioners and so on, who again are usually quite willing to pay for content for use in role playing in the virtual world.<p>I originally joined because I was interested in the technology side of things (I read an article somewhere about players using the in-game scripting systems to create 'virus objects' which spread across the world, which I thought was interesting enough to merit checking out) but I stayed because I found I had inadvertently formed a group of friends, and I even ended up getting engaged (in reality) to somebody I met there.<p>In a sense, Second Life has thrived, but not as a clean, bright new frontier as originally intended, but instead as a kind of collaborative roleplaying framework for people whose tastes are not really catered for anywhere else.
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Newky将近 13 年前
In my first year of college, I bagged my first programming job using the Linden Scripting Language. I spent the majority of that Summer working "in-world" as part of Trinity College Dublin's CRITE project.<p>There was some real prospects in this area in terms of educational value for children but unfortunately the questionable nature of most of SecondLife clienteles activities makes it impossible to allow Children to just wander around.<p>I spent a lot of time working with OpenSim, the open source version, which was very very buggy when I used it but it allowed you to run the server, and I had some experiences bringing it into schools. Unfortunately due to problems such as "Wow my man just lost all his clothes", we could not go through with it.<p>I found it a wonderful environment for learning, particularly for coding. Its a very hands on approach when you can set up a listener like<p>listener = llListen(1000)<p>and then set up basic events for when a certain thing was said. It had a lovely feel to the programming and I made my first real money on it as well. I made a set of playable bagpipes for some person online, he sent me $50 dollars on Paypal. I also donated a lot of code free of charge and even had my name included on someones PHD.<p>All in all, it was wonderful place to work when I was there.
Gring将近 13 年前
If people from SL are asking themselves why it didn't grow more, here's my story:<p>In the past 5 years, I've spent about 5 hours reading and watching videos about SL. And yet I've never once downloaded and run the client. You know why? Because the whole gameworld is just too ugly.<p>There are many reasons for its ugliness. A missing lighting engine, that most of it is very empty, bad frame rate / low drawing distance, and also the fact that it's all made by the users and the majority of users don't have any taste.<p>I'd rather spend my time in WOW or Zelda, they appeal much more to my eyes. Or, you know, meet in real life.
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pixie_将近 13 年前
At the moment SecondLife is miles of empty houses, casinos, and furries, it's pretty sad, but salvageable. First there needs to be zones with something like property taxes based on foot traffic over an area. This would incentivize change, and renovation of an area instead of static dead content that persists forever. Next the viewer client needs to be scaled down a bit. SecondLife is very much ahead of its time (advanced 3d modeling, advanced scripting of objects) the result is a lagged experience. Wonder why Minecraft took off? It's because building in Minecraft is simple, in SecondLife building is a pain in the ass. Again - way too advanced, no simple options for people. Anyways I hope someone eventually gets it right because SecondLife made the same mistakes AlphaWorld did and is meeting a similar fate. Im holding out on Carmack's 3d goggles to re-enter the metaverse and sword fight you guys.
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greggman将近 13 年前
Any second life users here? Speak up please.<p>I've always found Second Life strange in that they claim million(s) of users and yet I've never met one. I've met WoW players, I've met EQ players, Diablo players, CoD players, Halo players, FF11 players, GTA players, etc etc etc. But I've never met a Second Life player. Just bad luck I guess?
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facorreia将近 13 年前
One relevant fact that's not mentioned in the story is how deeply SL can affect people. There's a significant portion that becomes obsessed with it to the point it takes precedence over their "real life"'s responsibilities.<p>I've read many a story of both "addicted" gamers and family members of gamers and some of them can be quite devastating.<p><a href="https://www.google.com/#hl=en&#38;output=search&#38;q=second+life+ruined" rel="nofollow">https://www.google.com/#hl=en&#38;output=search&#38;q=second...</a>
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saraid216将近 13 年前
How are we defining a success and a failure here? Second Life is still around. They're not raking in millions, but AFAIK they're profitable, provide value to their customers in return, and occupy a dominant position in their market. In what way have they failed?
maked00将近 13 年前
SL has always been a exceedingly poor technology implementation of an ill defined objective. It's pretty much a failure and an oddity.<p>Korean MMO's do it better. You can have your x-rated chat with digital paper doll avatars that will look as sexy as your credit card can muster in the cash shop.<p>The fact that huge swaths of SL is outright advertising spam is another reason to avoid it.
TwoBit将近 13 年前
It's sad that companies are so often judged by their growth potential and not their static value. It's of course the investors that are making these judgments and not the players.
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zephjc将近 13 年前
I played SL since 2006 and until 2009 or so, and I still keep up with it from time to time. I think one problem it has is that it tries to do a lot of things, and does none of them well. Building was fun for a while, but you hit a limit with what you can do with their in-world tools, and now they allow users to upload assets created in 3rd party 3D modeling tools (anything that can export to Collada format)<p>Users are slowly making SL better but it almost seems in spite of Linden Lab, not because of them (the improvement from LL are few and very far between)
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azakai将近 13 年前
It's fair to say that Second Life didn't fail. It's profitable and has a large stable userbase. It definitely didn't live up to expectations, though.<p>From my perspective, the problem was that the entire architecture is built around simulating on the server. This makes servers expensive, creates lag, and entirely prevents a whole type of 3D environments - anything that requires lag-free responsiveness, like a first person shooter.<p>Imagine if people could create any kind of 3D game in Second Life. People would be using that instead of Unity/Unreal/other game engines.<p>Games are a potentially huge market, if Second Life had tied into that it could have grown its userbase tremendously. It had almost all the necessary technology - it just was structured in a way that you just can't do responsive games.<p>(Btw, why does the article use SecondLife without a space between the two words?)
mindstab将近 13 年前
I don't understand why the article talks about Secondlife in the past tense like it's dead. It looks like it's chugging along about as strong as ever
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stesch将近 13 年前
"SecondLife has 1 million active users" and "$700 million a year in virtual goods transacted" sound a bit strange together.<p>Users spend $700 a year in SL?
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Zigurd将近 13 年前
This is not succeeding:<p>"The problem — really the only problem, but a big one nonetheless — is they couldn’t ever find a way to make those numbers grow. Nothing they did worked, and Rosedale doubts that even early Facebook integration would have helped."<p>It has also stagnated technologically, since revenue can't fund a level of development that would open new applications or market segments, nor market such new capabilities.<p>Second Life is a spectacular and obvious failure. It isn't a game (but it attracted all the trolls and griefers a game would attract). It isn't anything in particular. If you go to the site, there is a question: "What is Second Life?" Follow the link, and play the video. Now tell me if you have an answer.
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zitterbewegung将近 13 年前
Why do we see failure in a sustainable business that makes money.
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hexagonal将近 13 年前
411 days ago, "The Failure Of Second Life": <a href="https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2574795" rel="nofollow">https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2574795</a>
derpmeister将近 13 年前
The reason why SL doesn't grow is because of all those furries ruining the place for everyone else. I never knew what yiffing was until I went on SL. Had they placed a few curbs on it, their world would've been better for everyone.
georgeecollins将近 13 年前
A long time ago when I was just starting out at Activision we had some early virtual reality world pitched to us. Probably it was Knowledge Adventure Worlds which became KA Worlds that became I don't know what. Anyway, the guy pitching it said, "This will allow people to create their own entertainment."<p>The guy who ran the studio then-- Howard Marks-- said, "If people wanted to create their own entertainment we would have gone out of business a long time ago."
wslh将近 13 年前
Isn't an opportunity to grow in the mobile space? I don't like to use Second Life in "desktop mode" but when I am on "mobile chill out mode" it sounds perfect!
joering2将近 13 年前
It would be nice, given the thread, to hear experience of someone that makes money in SL. I watched the show about some guy that sells sex toys and was making seven figures. Wonder how hard it is to get there (I assume hard but would be great to hear some real users' opinion).
TazeTSchnitzel将近 13 年前
I think Second Life has failed. Sure, it lives, but in 9 years Linden Labs have been unable to make the client run any smoother or load any faster.
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Tichy将近 13 年前
I enjoyed SL for a while. Some ideas to get more users: make it easier to obtain a good looking avatar, and fix the clunky controls.
tete将近 13 年前
Just in case someone doesn't know. You can build your own:<p><a href="http://opensimulator.org/" rel="nofollow">http://opensimulator.org/</a>