Ask HN: Ethical VC Funds?

63 点作者 asim3 个月前

Are there any ethical VC funds? This is a genuine question. It feels like the majority of venture firms can rationalise away their position as doing good for the world but when you start to dig into it, the sole goal is making money and who they make money for isn't always the most righteous of people or entities. Even then many of the individuals at firms can be questionable, involved in scandals. And the things invested in, while there can be a thematic preference, often everything is thrown out the window in the pursuit of greed or missing out on a deal.Are there ethical VC funds out there? Is there room for a more altruistic form of investing? Is the sole goal just making money for them?Could cooperative syndicates (like angel syndicates) be a good way to do it instead? Or is it the lack of follow on funding that's really going to kill a company?

19 条评论

mtmail3 个月前

Some funds are about distributing money, not about getting something in return. Often the work is or remains open source. The classical VC and angels expect a monetary reward.<a href="https://nlnet.nl/themes/" rel="nofollow">https://nlnet.nl/themes/</a><a href="https://www.sovereign.tech/programs/fund" rel="nofollow">https://www.sovereign.tech/programs/fund</a><a href="https://prototypefund.de/en/" rel="nofollow">https://prototypefund.de/en/</a>

colinbartlett3 个月前

One alternative VC fund that comes to mind is TinySeed: <a href="https://tinyseed.com" rel="nofollow">https://tinyseed.com</a>Though perhaps the "ethics" you're referring to, they invest in bootstrapped companies who aren't necessarily on the venture track moonshot rat race. For me, that's a big part of the unethical side of VC: Throwing money at a 1,000 ideas and expecting 999 of them to fail in hopes of one goldmine.My own company, StatusGator, took a small investment from them even though we swore we'd never take VC money. It was a great choice for us and I feel TinySeed's ethics and values far outshine other investors.

tlb3 个月前

The best way to invest ethically is to do it yourself. When you give your money to a VC firm to do it, they end up following bogus rules like ESG.When I invest, it's always a mix of wanting the company's product to exist in the world and wanting to make money. Making money lets you invest in future things you want to exist in the world, so it's at least a good instrumental goal. But more importantly, companies that don't make money usually don't grow. So the social impact of investing in unsuccessful companies is usually small. The goals are mostly aligned as long as the product is something you want to exist.

KaisoEnt3 个月前

Look into ESG.This is a whole controversial world in and of itself.

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tnolet3 个月前

There are two parts to this:- The Limited Partners (LPs) e.g. the folks putting money into the VC fund. E.g. would you consider money from Saudi Arabia be ethical?- The portfolio strategy. E.g. would you find investing in some company in the carbon based fuel space be ethical?

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mhluongo3 个月前

There are certainly funds with a thesis that you might consider good for the world. Eg social impact, femtech, women and BIPOC-founded co's, etc.LPs are often large allocators like pension funds who are making decisions for other people's money. I do think there's room here, but you have to ask yourself who the LP's are.

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memhole3 个月前

Here’s an example of one that shut down: <a href="https://calmfund.com/writing/pause" rel="nofollow">https://calmfund.com/writing/pause</a>Over the years, my consensus is that if you’re playing by values you’re leaving alpha on the table. Alpha that another company will try and likely scoop. Not that we shouldn’t keep trying, but it likely makes an already difficult game that much harder.Someone posted some EU funds. So, maybe the EU spends more effort on this?As far as the US, you can also look into state grants. Those from what I’ve researched have requirements such as partnering with research institutions or other stipulations like matching. It’s nowhere near, here’s my idea and thank you for the check.

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marxisttemp3 个月前

VC is fundamentally unethical. It is “the rich get richer” made manifest. If you want ethics in business, start by making a product that can make a profit in the free market without using VC bankroll to undercut the competition.

gwbas1c3 个月前

> Is there room for a more altruistic form of investing?One common trend that I see is that the bad guys often think they are the good guys; and the good guys often screw things up so badly that they create nasty messes and end up turning into the bad guys accidentally.For example, in Massachusetts we want to meet climate goals. To do this, we subsidize homeowners in getting heat pumps and updating insulation. To fund the subsidies, electric and gas bills went up and many poor people can't afford them. And oil bills stayed the same, incentivizing people to continue to heat with dirty fuel.

joshdavham3 个月前

Maybe I’m a bit naive, but I’ve never really thought of VC as being unethical, although I’ve obviously heard of some bad stories (e.g., David Sacks and Zenefits).What makes you feel that much of VC is unethical?

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tyrw3 个月前

I worked with Capricorn [1] for several years, and these topics were always top of mind there.They have the goal of making money first and foremost, but subject to the investments themselves being good for society, and serving LPs who do the same. E.g. they work closely with Skoll Foundation [2] and Skoll Global Threats Fund [3].Another fund that we worked closely with was Omidyar Network [4]. They have more of a hybrid model of investing + philanthropy under one org. It meant they could do some projects that we couldn't at Capricorn, but also made it harder to measure concrete outcomes, which LPs tend to want.1. <a href="https://capricornllc.com" rel="nofollow">https://capricornllc.com</a>2. <a href="https://skoll.org" rel="nofollow">https://skoll.org</a>3. <a href="https://skoll.org/jeff-skoll-group" rel="nofollow">https://skoll.org/jeff-skoll-group</a>4. <a href="https://omidyar.com" rel="nofollow">https://omidyar.com</a>

Havoc3 个月前

I'd say you'd need to look at the individual partners - any sort of integrity will ultimately have to flow from there.I suspect in practice most would like to see themselves as good people with integrity but ultimately money will override all but the most egregious stuff.

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JumpCrisscross3 个月前

Make your money and put it to use. I’m sceptical of dual-mission VCs as change agents for society. They do good work. But not as good as the most militant non-profits or political entrepreneurs. At the same time, they fail to generate the returns that might empower you to become that change agent through wealth.> cooperative syndicates (like angel syndicates) be a good way to do it insteadThese are fun to be in but a social club by another name. You’ll have some wins, hopefully, but if you calculate an IRR it should wind up around the S&P 500 minus a country-club fee.

erlend_sh3 个月前

Purpose Ventures invests in companies made for steward ownership:<a href="https://purpose-economy.org/en/ventures/" rel="nofollow">https://purpose-economy.org/en/ventures/</a><a href="https://purpose-economy.org/en/whats-steward-ownership/" rel="nofollow">https://purpose-economy.org/en/whats-steward-ownership/</a>Think companies like Patagonia, Sharetribe and Ecosia.

YetAnotherNick3 个月前

> Is the sole goal just making money for them?There are charities and non profits. Most top VCs have some investments in those which they expect to loose money, but which could be more than covered up by their profit seeking investments. If you want VC which only does losing investments you likely wont find any big ones

ashu14613 个月前

For us YC has been the best fund to interact with so far, there opinions are unbiased and they are very helpful. Mentors have a lot of actual wisdom to share.We have also worked with pioneer fund and they are also very helpful and genuine

fooker3 个月前

The litmus test for this is whether they are willing to fund sweatshop-automator-pro-max.

MrMcCall3 个月前

That's an excellent question, and well put.If you want make money, it's best to deal with people who really, really care about making money, to the exclusion of everything else. The problem with dealing with those sort of folks is exactly as you say, and that is because our happiness depends on sharing with others who haven't had the same opportunities we've had. As such, dealing with those people means dealing with people who don't give a damn about anyone who can't further their bottom line, including the masses of forgotten-about poors.I suppose you're going to have a hard time finding such people, because: a) if they were charitable, they'd already be putting their wealth to good use, and b) they're not going to structure their investments in a VC kind of way.I imagine that folks with the money start a VC fund would probably just rant about how being WOKE is a problem with the rest of us, and not their assinine amoral life choices. I would stay far, far away from those fools.If you can find private person who wants to help you succeed without taking ownership of your work, that would be best, but I doubt you will find that under the VC moniker.

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NewUser763123 个月前

> It feels like the majority of venture firms can rationalise away their position as doing good for the world but when you start to dig into it, the sole goal is making money and who they make money for isn't always the most righteous of people or entities.Sorry but this is dripping with immaturity and naivety."It feels" - speak like a grown up, and provide actual examples. If you wanted to, e.g., call out VC firms that had funded specific defense/military projects for example, that would be a conversation (not that those are inherently bad)."Sole goal is making money" - do you understand that capitalism and advancing business capabilities of a society is the driving force that's brought the most people out of poverty, ever? Making money, and helping people make money, is good. It means bringing to market products that others want, ergo products that help and enrich others.Can there be questionable counterexamples? Maybe, but you didn't reference any, and it still doesn't negate the fact that VC is not an inherently unethical industry, which you seem to believe for some reason ("Are there any ethical VC funds?" as if they are unethical until proven otherwise).> Even then many of the individuals at firms can be questionable, involved in scandals. And the things invested in, while there can be a thematic preference, often everything is thrown out the window in the pursuit of greed or missing out on a deal.My issue with your post is that you throw around vague ideas and accusations with zero examples, and have a 'guilty until proven innocent' mindset for an entire industry which has helped create immense value.

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