Apple's AI isn't a letdown. AI is the letdown

143 点作者 ndr42大约 2 个月前

39 条评论

roughly大约 2 个月前

Two thoughts:The first is that LLMs are bar none the absolute best natural language processing and producing systems we’ve ever made. They are absolutely fantastic at taking unstructured user inputs and producing natural-looking (if slightly stilted) output. The problem is that they’re not nearly as good at almost anything else we’ve ever needed a computer to do as other systems we’ve built to do those things. We invented a linguist and mistook it for an engineer.The second is that there’s a maxim in media studies which is almost universally applicable, which is that the first use of a new media is to recapitulate the old. The first TV was radio shows, the first websites looked like print (I work in synthetic biology, and we’re in the “recapitulating industrial chemistry” phase). It’s only once people become familiar with the new medium (and, really, when you have “natives” to that medium) that we really become aware of what the new medium can do and start creating new things. It strikes me we’re in that recapitulating phase with the LLMs - I don’t think we actually know what these things are good for, so we’re just putting them everywhere and redoing stuff we already know how to do with them, and the results are pretty lackluster. It’s obvious there’s a “there” there with LLMs (in a way there wasn’t with, say, Web 3.0, or “the metaverse,” or some of the other weird fads recently), but we don’t really know how to actually wield these tools yet, and I can’t imagine the appropriate use of them will be chatbots when we do figure it out.

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martinald大约 2 个月前

I just do not understand this attitude. ChatGPT alone has hundreds of millions of active users that are clearly getting value from it, despite any mistakes it may make.To me the almost unsolvable problem Apple has is wanting to do as much as possible on device, but also have been historically very stingy with RAM (on iOS and Mac devices - iOS more understandably, given it doesn't really need huge amounts of RAM until LLMs came along). This gives them a real real problem, having to use very small models which hallucinate a lot more than giant cloud hosted ones.Even if they did manage to get 16GB of RAM on their new iPhones that is still only going to be able to fit a 7b param model at a push (leaving 8GB for 'system' use).In my experience even the best open source 7B local models are close to unusable. They'd have been mindblowning a few years ago but when you are used to "full size" cutting edge models it feels like an enormous downgrade. And I assume this to always be the case; while small models are always improving, so are the full size ones, so there will always be a big delta between them, and people are already used to the large ones.So I think Apple probably needs to shift to using cloud services more like their Private Compute idea, but they have an issue there in so much that they have 1b+ users and it is not trivial at all to be able to handle that level of cloud usage for core iOS/Mac features (I suspect this is why virtually nothing uses Private Compute at the moment). Even if each iOS user only did 10 "cloud LLM" requests a day, that's over 10b/requests a day (10x the scale that OpenAI currently handles). And in reality it'd ideally be orders of magnitude more than that given how many possible integration options they are for mobile devices alone.

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ichiwells大约 2 个月前

One of apple’s biggest missed with “AI” in my opinion, is not building a universal search.For all the hype LLM generation gets, I think the rise of LLM-backed “semantic” embedding search does not get enough attention. It’s used in RAG (which inherits the hallucinatory problems), but seems underutilized elsewhere.The worst (and coincidentally/paradoxically I use the most) searches I’ve seen is Gmail and Dropbox, both of which cannot find emails or files that I know exist, even if using the exact email subject and file name keywords.Apple could arguably solve this with a universal search SDK, and I’d value this far more than yet-another-summarize-this-paragraph tool.

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MarkusWandel大约 2 个月前

The scenario in the article, about how AI is "usually" right in queries like "which airport is my mom's flight landing at and when?" is exactly the problem with Google's AI summaries as well. Several times recently I've googled something really obscure like how to get fr*king suspend working in Linux on a recent-ish laptop, and it's given me generic pablum instad of the actual, obscure trick that makes it work (type a 12-key magic sequence, get advanced BIOS options, pick an option way down a scrolling list to nuke fr*king modern suspend and restore S3 sleep... happiness in both Windows and Linux in the dual boot environment). So it just makes the answers harder to find, instead of helping.

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pram大约 2 个月前

I've been experiencing "AI" making things worse. Grammarly worked fine for a decade+ but now since, I guess, they've been trying to cram more LLM junk into it the recommendations have been a lot less reliable. Now it's sometimes missing even obvious typos.

originalvichy大约 2 个月前

AI working with your OS is absolutely the letdown. I do not want to give my personal computer's data a direct feed into the hands of the same developers who lie about copyright abuses when mining data.90% of the mass consumer AI tech demos in the past 2-3 years are the exact same demos that voice assistants used to do with just speech-to-text + search functions. And these older tech demos are already things only 10% of users probably did regularly. So they are adding AI features to halo features that look good in marketing but people never use.Keep the OS secure and let me use an Apple AI app in 2-3 years when they have rolled their own LLM.

pedalpete大约 2 个月前

This is Apple's spin machine working overtime trying to say "we're not failing at AI, everyone is failing at AI".I'm not sure anyone is going to buy it, but it doesn't cost them anything to get a few of their PR hacks to give it a try.It's about as convincing as "we didn't build a bad phone, you're just holding it wrong!".

4ndrewl大约 2 个月前

"Apple made a rare stumble"Auto. Vision Pro. AI.Is there a pattern emerging here?

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nixpulvis大约 2 个月前

If you can't explain how it works, I don't want it.If your explanation boils down to a bunch of "it should do..." or "most of the time it does..." then I still don't want it.

ohgr大约 2 个月前

Hyper optimism in this thread.Outside tech users it’s a novelty that lasts about a week or disappears in a puff of smoke the moment money is asked for it.The whole industry is blind to the fact the market doesn’t need it and it it doesn’t really solve any problems. It’s not even a means to an end.What consumers want is to be left the fuck alone and their stuff to last longer. But this doesn’t make numbers go up.

upcoming-sesame大约 2 个月前

No, Apple AI is a letdown regardless

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bradgessler大约 2 个月前

Apple would be much better saying to the world, "we're going to make Siri better". That's concrete, people get it, LLMs are good at it, and something we'd all appreciate.Instead they're failing to build a bunch of stuff that nobody asked for under the banner, "Apple Intelligence".Please Apple, just make Siri better.

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icu大约 2 个月前

Where exactly is the Apple Intelligence that was advertised? Siri absolutely cannot go into your phone's calendar and see who you bumped into at some bar or café. I've been using the Pixel 9 Pro as my daily driver and while I really wanted to install CalyxOS on it, I've found Gemini to be actually useful (and I'm generally biased against Google).Apple is behind the curve like Google was prior to Gemini 2.5 Pro, but unlike Google, I cannot see Apple having the talent to catch up unless they make some expensive acquisitions and even then they will still be behind. I was shocked at how good Gemini 2.5 Pro is. The cost and value for money difference is so big that I'm considering switching away from my API usage of Claude Sonnet 3.7 to Gemini 2.5 Pro.

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rossdavidh大约 2 个月前

The worst thing about "AI" is its name. It isn't intelligent, it isn't even dumb. If the current wave had been called "neural networks" or "large language models", then the hype wouldn't have been as breathless, but the disappointment wouldn't be as sharp either, because it wouldn't be used for things it isn't suited for.It's an algorithm; it's just an algorithm. It's useful for a few things. It isn't useful for most things. Like MVC, or relational databases, or finite state machines, or OOP, it's not something you should have to (or want to) tell the end user that you are using in the internals. The reason most "AI" products brag about using "AI", is there isn't anything else interesting about them.

tallytarik大约 2 个月前

“Hey Siri open the curtains”“I found some web results. I can show them if you ask again from your iPhone”Nah, Apple is the letdown, and has been since before ChatGPT.

andrewstuart大约 2 个月前

AI is at the Web 1.0 stage when people didn’t really know how to make the most of it.It sounds ridiculous now but Web 1.0 was mostly about putting companies paper brochures onto websites.It sounds doubly ridiculous that Web 1.0 came to an end when the market crashed because no one could figure out how to make money from the internet.Web 1.0 started in 1994 and it would be ten years until Facebook arrived.So AI has some really really big surprises in store that no one has thought of yet and when they do, fortunes will be made.

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deadbabe大约 2 个月前

We keep trying to find justifications for business use of LLMs.We keep getting shut down by simpler, purpose built tools that work predictably.LLM is just good for synthesizing vague inputs.

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saagarjha大约 2 个月前

Nah, Apple just never implemented good AI. I think AI itself is a letdown but let’s not forget that Apple claimed they were going to implement that and they didn’t. If someone tells you they’re going to eat a hamburger and then they just don’t eat lunch you can feel they’re making bad decisions even if the thing they set out to do was also possibly a bad decision.

Farer大约 1 个月前

I really dislike extreme views. 0 or 1. This is a concept that only fits the Digital world. The world we live in is analog. Although we call the world we live in a 'Digital World,' in reality, the 'Digit' itself is simply recorded on a certain analog machine.Just because the 'AI' services we use today cause certain levels of error doesn't mean we can disregard their value as zero. Are Apple’s services flawless? (Vision Pro... I won’t say more.) Since humans are not perfect, everything created by humans can never be perfect. Between 0 and 1, there are countless values like 0.1, 0.0002, etc. Ignoring this concept is something I personally find truly repulsive.When the so-called 'AI' industry was booming, Apple was completely fumbling. Why? Because Apple is not perfect either. After all, Apple is run by people.

flippy_flops大约 2 个月前

With Apple/iOS, I can’t help but think of the Joker’s quote, “You have nothing… Nothing to do with all your strength.” The efficiency half is excellent but what with the power? AR? Gaming? AI seems the first broad fit. And where was Apple? Literally chasing cars and an ill conceived VR headset.I say this as a massive Apple fanboy. AI was heavily advertised as a selling point of iPhone 15 Pro and is completely MIA 6 months later. It’s a major letdown. It’s not the end of the world, but let’s just call it what it is.For those saying Apple doesn’t release imperfect products, may I introduce to you Siri? It was average when they bought it and it’s become a punch line.And there are so many uses of AI that don’t have to be at the risk level of, “Oops, AI left grandma at LeGuardia.” Apple should go back to its roots and provide high quality LLM/MCP and other API sdks to developers and let them go nuts. Then just clone or buy the apps that work like they always do.

smallnix大约 2 个月前

> Apple’s obsession with privacy and security is the reason most of us don’t think twice to scan our faces, store bank account information or share our real-time location via our phones.People do that because it's very useful, not because it's safe.

ndr42大约 2 个月前

The Quote: "AI can never fail, it can only be failed" is something to think about

seydor大约 2 个月前

Trough of disillusionment

aaomidi大约 2 个月前

Yes and no.Siri didn’t need to suck all these years. Even before the LLM craze.

thedanner大约 1 个月前

So much Apple apologeticism in this article. 100s of apple employees planned an event where they got on stage and said to the world "we have working AI use cases." And they haven't delivered. There are no excuses.

throwawa14223大约 2 个月前

I've noticed that Siri has gotten far worse at playing a song based on a verbal request. Frequently Siri now assures me that songs are not downloaded to my phone only for me to discover that they have been the whole time.

puppycodes大约 2 个月前

They just need more time to implement it.Most people still have no idea how useful it can be.I'm a firm beleiver it will be an absolute godsend to older folks who struggle to learn new interfaces and technologies.

amelius大约 2 个月前

Only if you are susceptible to the RDF.

bigyabai大约 2 个月前

Ooh I like this one. "Apple's chips aren't slowing down. TSMC is."

epolanski大约 2 个月前

Apple went from $170 to $220 after the Apple Intelligence bs promises.Still sits there despite having long plateaued in revenue and is still priced for some impressive revenue growth.Go figure.

lvl155大约 2 个月前

This sort of takeaway is from people who do not have experience in cutting edge. AI is developing at such a rapid pace right now. I’ve seen some amazing things in the past three months.I will say Apple AI completely sucks for a company with all the resources available to them.

stavros大约 2 个月前

To me, "AI is the letdown" is the letdown. The sheer lack of imagination and wonder you must have to see what are almost virtual people, something that was _unthinkable_ five years ago, and to say it's a letdown, I will never understand.We have programs, actual programs that you can run on your laptop, that will understand images and describe them to you, understand your voice, talk to you, explain things to you. We have experts that will answer your every question, that will research things for you, and all we keep saying is how disappointing it is that they aren't better than humans.To me, this is very much the old joke of "wow, your dog can sing?!" "Eh, it's not that impressive, he's pitchy". To go from "AI that can converse fluently is impossible, basically science fiction" to "AI is a letdown" just shows me the infinite capability humans have to find anything disappointing, no matter how jaw-droppingly amazing it is.

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ohso4大约 2 个月前

> Apple’s obsession with privacy and security is the reason most of us don’t think twice to scan our faces, store bank account information or share our real-time location via our phones.Uh do you have any freaking idea of what happens with your location data? bank account information is a matter of security. So is face ID data.

LeoPanthera大约 2 个月前

AI might be disappointing, but Apple Intelligence is definitely a stumble. I've been playing with Gemini and it works shockingly well. I fully expect Apple to catch up, but it will take a while for them to recover from the reputational damage.

kittikitti大约 2 个月前

Why is a source about AI from CNN being taken seriously? Isn't their "journalism" just clickbait?

gibbitz大约 2 个月前

I think AI is just running up against a company whose mantra was "it just works" and finding consumers who expect a working product won't tolerate the lack of quality "AI" has delivered. Welcome to reality venture capitalists...

Workaccount2大约 2 个月前

>If it’s 100% accurate, it’s a fantastic time saver. If it is anything less than 100% accurate, it’s useless.The insane levels of hypocrisy hearing this come from a mainstream media source. The damage that has been done to all of society by misrepresenting and half-truthing about events to appease audiences is unrivaled, yet here they are on the high horse of "anything less than 100% accurate is useless"Take note CNN, take fucking note.

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ginkgotree大约 2 个月前

Right. CNN is absolutely the authority here.

bbarnett大约 2 个月前

"Hey, I know! We should spend billions replacing code and data that provide the precise same output every time (or random from data we choose), with completely random, uncurated data that changes with every new model, because why not! It's awesome!", says every company now.AI is not useful if you want curated fact, if you want consistent output, if you want repeated quality.How about training an AI on 1990s style encyclopedias, with their low error rate.Even wikipedia has random yahoos coming in and changing pages about the moon landing, to say it was filmed in a studio.AI is being trained on random, it outputs random.

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