Choviva: Chocolate replacement with less CO2 emissions

This is classic deck-chair reorg, instead of actually helping the environment.<p>China outputs gigatons of coal smoke. The US ships goods by individual trucks that could travel by train for a fraction of the fuel usage. We dispose of millions of plastic, floating pieces of trash in our oceans.<p>But if we slightly decrease the carbon footprint of a Hershey&#x27;s bar, we&#x27;ll be OK.<p>I use a stainless steel straw, so I&#x27;m doing my part!

I used to watch sci-fi films and think: &quot;well this isn&#x27;t realistic, people simply wouldn&#x27;t accept eating Soylent Green or a nutrient paste ration&quot;<p>Now I realise that these things will come to us branded up as desirable and high-status. It isn&#x27;t ultra-processed pea protein, this is a &#x27;vegan steak&#x27;<p>Human beings evolved to eat whole foods. If you&#x27;re going to eat something else, you better be very, very sure about the long-term effects.

&gt; Here’s what we’ve found out: It’s not about the cocoa-beans, but about the way they are treated during the manufacturing process.<p>I eat a lot of high end single origin chocolate bars, and I simply don’t believe this. Two bars from the same brand at the same percentage of cocoa content using different beans taste completely different. In exactly the same way as wine or coffee. It’s one of the most interesting parts of eating good chocolate. I just don’t believe this approach will ever replace my chocolate consumption, but may have a shot at the larger market of bad chocolate bars.

If I’m going to eat a fast-food burger other than in-n-out I may as well eat a beyond burger or something else non-meat because McD’s and BK’s meat are nothing like real meat.<p>If I’m going to eat a Kit Kat or some other gas station candy bar I may as well eat artificial chocolate because it pretty much already is fake chocolate.<p>However I can’t eat a Beyond BK (do they make those anymore? Or the White Castle beyond burgers?), probably because they cost more than the original product. And I assume this fake chocolate will have the same problem.<p>They’ll try to sell it as a luxury item because that price point is the only way they can stay in business but it just won’t be that good.

They changed the chocolate recipe in East Germany because they didn&#x27;t have the ingredients.<p>At one point they sold &quot;chocolate&quot; made of fish meal.

Made primarily from sunflower seeds? I just don&#x27;t think that&#x27;s going to taste like chocolate.<p><i>Process:<p>Fermentation: The sunflower seeds undergo an innovative fermentation-like process, similar to ancient beer brewing technology, to enhance their flavor.<p>Roasting: The fermented seeds are then gently roasted. Grinding: The roasted ingredients are ground into a concentrate that resembles cocoa powder.<p>Mixing and Conching: The concentrate is mixed with additional ingredients, ground further, and conched to achieve a smooth, creamy texture, similar to traditional chocolate</i><p>Carob was the old-timey chocolate substitute in the 70s (probably because of inflation back then as well). Carob is kind of chocolate tasting, but it&#x27;s better to just say it&#x27;s carob instead of trying to pretend it&#x27;s chocolate - it definitely didn&#x27;t have the same smoothness as chocolate.

Replacing cocoa as the base for a chocolate that can work with local crops and be price competitive without being too dissimilar has been a fancy of mine since the cost of cocoa went through the roof in the last year. My wife and I run a small wholesale bakery and I’ve been dying to try and come up with my own alternatives. I heard there has been work using Fava beans, which I like the idea of because it’s easier to grow those in more places than the cocoa bean. Sunflower seeds is an interesting base, I wonder what their “fermentation-like” process is.

This is going to be directed at poor people, who can&#x27;t afford real chocolate. It might taste better than the puke taste of hershey. But replacing Cocoa butter is just the same trend as using food emulsifiers and thickeners, and stabilizers as is done with other foods. Taking out fat and replacing it with substitutes, hasn&#x27;t really corresponded to people losing weight. It probably won&#x27;t be good for you.

Interesting that humanity comes up with stuff like this in times where shipping is cheapest. Wouldn&#x27;t this have been much more impactful in the 19th century or so when getting chocolate was more expensive than now? Or is the process that hard that it can be only done with modern technology?

On another note, I wonder when the next &quot;less than 4kb bundle size&quot; framework we&#x27;re going to see. Somehow, that always ends up mattering!<p>Idk, I feel like it&#x27;d be good if people could engage with &quot;looks tasty relative to savings (carbon or monetary)&quot; or something equivalent.

I see why they&#x27;re leaning into the environmental angle, but I think they&#x27;re better off marketing their product as upscale, <i>better</i> than regular chocolate.<p>They should be selling upscale, luxury-priced high-end &quot;chocolate&quot; bars, doing taste tests against fancy brands.

Interestingly, they have a whole bunch of products (both from renowned brands and store brands) in their home market in Germany on the shelves already: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;choviva.com&#x2F;products" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;choviva.com&#x2F;products</a>

The CO2 angle is a weird one. I can&#x27;t see this succeeding on anything more than novelty scale unless it&#x27;s cheaper than chocolate.<p>If it&#x27;s cheaper, this could easily be a vanilla&#x2F;vanillin situation.

This immediately reminded me the episode from Friends about Mockolate - is just me?

Well my wife is allergic to cocoa, so that&#x27;s an interesting alternative.

why not replace the sugar with stevia?