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A Tor of the Dark Web

310 点作者 slifty将近 13 年前

19 条评论

runn1ng将近 13 年前
Yes, I know I shouldn't say it out loud, but here I am saying it (take me, Police) - out of curiosity, I went to Hard Candy section of The Hidden Wiki. (Yes, it is <i>exactly</i> what you would think it is.)<p>GOD.<p>There are seriously forums full of pedofiles sharing pictures and - maybe worse? - their stories and wisdoms. Maybe out of utter fascination, I spend about few hours on there and I felt like I want to murder all humanity. On one of these forums, there was this alleged "doctor", who adviced people, from what age you can have sex with your children without their doctor to notice. Tips how to kidnap young children. The worst thing was that I just knew that - if they don't do something stupid - they are basically untracable and uncatchable, while I would simply want to catch them all and kill them one by one. (I am sorry for being so expressive.)<p>There were also some picture forums but really I couldn't stand that, I just wanted to vomit while I was shaking.<p>I... am not sure why I am writing this. I am all for Tor. But we have to admit - when everything is allowed and anonymous, <i>EVERYTHING</i> is allowed and anonymous. And the dark parts of humanity flow on top. Drug markets, weapon markets, assasin markets (altough I don't know how sersiously to take those), terrorist websites, child porn websites.<p>But - as hard it is for me to say it - to see that the seriously f...d up child molesters are freely allowed to say really anything there and noone has a chance to catch them just shows that Tor is <i>really</i> anonymous and safe.<p>edit: I do not know if The Hidden Wiki is still operating, if the dark places I visited are still operating, it is about one year and I did not feel any urge to revisit it again.
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klearvue将近 13 年前
A word of advice for those living under truly oppressive governments - do not connect to Tor directly (nor to a Tor bridge, to be on the safe side). Get a cheap VPS/EC2 abroad and use SSH tunnel to connect to that and from then onwards - to a Tor bridge. The reason is that, if connecting to Tor directly, security services will be able to figure out you are using Tor (although not what you are using it for) and may take an interest.
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TazeTSchnitzel将近 13 年前
Ooh, the Tor darknet. I went there recently out of curiosity. You can get used to doing everything over Tor quite quickly, if you use it for everything you don't really notice the latency.<p>Yes, Tor has CP, but I didn't look for it so I didn't find it. Same with all manner of other illegal content, pretty sure it's there.<p>I2P and Freenet are more interesting than Tor, though, because they are truly P2P. Freenet is basically a distributed hash table (DHT) for HTML, CSS, image, and other files. It filters scripts and cross-origin requests out of HTML before serving them. I2P is like Tor, but everyone's a relay node (truly P2P, no central origin), and it's faster, but I haven't tried I2P. I have been on Freenet... it's slower than Tor!
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tptacek将近 13 年前
Tor was not "designed by the Navy" to protect dignitaries in cars or ships or whatever it is this article is alluding to. It was an academic research project for the NRL's CHACS group (NRL : CHACS :: MIT : Lincoln Lab).<p>If you look at the project's publication history, it was almost from the jump (and continues to be today) a project intended to frustrate online censorship. The DOD, via both DARPA and the NRL, continues to sponsor the project.
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telecuda将近 13 年前
I wish there were a simple way to communicate how large and widespread CP is, and how much law enforcement could use your smarts to go after these guys.<p>There are more households sharing CP in your community than there are bus stops. (We can roughly map IPs of known CP files advertised over torrent networks.)<p>There are too few innovators in this space because specifics on CP networks are privy to law enforcement, and investigators are often patrol cops who get promoted into a child crimes unit.<p>It's fine (and true) to say these technologies are used for many more things than CP, but that's not an excuse to turn a blind eye to it, anymore than Craigslist does to child exploitation.
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Revisor将近 13 年前
Tor is meant for dissidents and the oppressed, that's all fine and cool. But for me as a business community admin Tor always, always means trouble. Either the user using it is a scammer, a fraud or in the best case only a troll.
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jorgem将近 13 年前
The things I always wonder about TOR: Won't I look like someone else's computer? Is it possible for me to get in trouble for because someone else's traffic exits from my home network?
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columbo将近 13 年前
FYI this is all I get running chromium in linux: <a href="http://i.imgur.com/7FUlr.png" rel="nofollow">http://i.imgur.com/7FUlr.png</a>
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taixzo将近 13 年前
I can't tell from this article whether the author is for or against Tor.
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slifty将近 13 年前
I'd like some more good Tor jokes, by the way...
derrida将近 13 年前
People that argue that Tor enables crime do not realise that Tor also enables law enforcement (LE). Anonymity has been a tactic of LE from the beginning. Undercover LE use anonymous looking clothes to blend in with civilians to monitor criminals, police fighting drug cartels in Mexico wear masks to protect themselves and their families, informants require anonymity in order to assist LE with information. But there aren't sites in the onion exchanging this sort of information, you don't see it, which is the way it is designed to be.
muyuu将近 13 年前
I hate it how all discussion about anonymity and privacy ends up in CP.
runjake将近 13 年前
&#62; They can’t decrypt messages but they are able to track where everything comes from and where it is going. They can’t tell what you’re saying, but they have all they need.<p>He's talking about SSL here, right? For the record, this is completely incorrect. If <i>"they"</i> have access to a trusted CA (and circumstantial evidence says they do), they can MITM and snoop on whatever they want.<p>SSL encryption is not secure against state-sponsored attackers and sophisticated criminal enterprises.
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dumbluck将近 13 年前
Places where illegal content is shared and people communicate for nefarious reasons and tools that create these places are just magnets for those wishing to find such people.<p>Anyone that chooses to take part in such things is at a heightened risk, no matter what they are doing.<p>There is no guaranteed right to privacy, regardless what your government decrees or what the tool you're using claims to do.<p>Those using Tor will be caught and charged as if they are enabling what the others are doing.<p>Be warned.
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molo将近 13 年前
A couple questions.<p>1. Are users of .onion services protected from the server just as well as the hidden service is protected?<p>2. What reassurances are there that tormail is not a honeypot?
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eliben将近 13 年前
Can you point to a good technical description of how Tor works under the hood?
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co-n-sci-o-us将近 13 年前
Tor is the solution to getting hellbanned at HN.<p>That is "censorship", no?<p>Tor is also the solution to your Twitter API woes. Like it or not. I'm sure many SEO people use it to get around Google's restrictions. These are not necessarily uses that infringe anyone's IP. Twitter is UGC. And Google caches the entire web, indiscriminantly.<p>Tor, like the 'net itself, is controversial. It can be used for bad things. It can also be used for good things. It could be used to break criminal laws, or to enable copyright infringment. It could be used to violate TOS that may or may not be enforceable in civil court. Or it could be used just to evade idiosyncratic censorship by some webmaster that has no legal basis whatsoever. (This comment itself is being posted through Tor.) It is, however, any way you look at it, useful.<p>There may be an "intended purpose" for Tor. But as with almost all software, that means little. Users decide how they will use it. And that is unpredictable.<p>Did the folks at MIT, when they developed Tor, say to themselves, "You know, this will be used to commit crime"? Probably. But they also probably envisioned some other uses that were of undisputed benefit to society.<p>As someone else said, MIT is still behind Tor. Grep the source for the Tor client for IP numbers. You will find that some belong to MIT. My understanding is that Tor is controlled by a small group (maybe only one person) because like anything else that uses a network, there has to be a bootstrap, a "root" that hands out the initial addresses. And anyone that uses the Tor trusts that root. Somewhere there is/are a few people with a great responsibility on their hands: they make Tor possible, for better, or worse.<p>More people need to use Tor for non-criminal purposes. Using Tor as a workaround for censorship, whether it is on HN, or in some oppressed country is to be expected. If you are the censor, and you don't like it, ban Tor. It is not difficult. HN does not ban Tor.<p>One of the great myths on the 'net is that an IP address equates to a machine or a customer account. False. It represents an interface, which is itself an ephemeral concept. Interfaces can be created, cloned or destroyed at the blink of an eye.<p>This may all be frightening or it may be exciting, it all depends on how you look at it. It shouldn't matter whether you are a good samaritan or a criminal. It is just technology. Abstract tools. A hammer can be used to build something or it can be used to destroy something. It has no moral sensibility on its own.<p>That's up to you, the user.<p>As a Tor user (I can't post to HN without it), it bothers me that others are using it for criminal purposes. But when I look at hammer, I see a tool for creation, not destruction. I think like a carpenter. What can we build?<p>The hammer has no consciousness of its own, any more than Tor does.
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nacker将近 13 年前
Tor is good, but totalitarianism is galloping to control the internet. They HATE the freedom we have come to take for granted, and they are surely encouraged by how easily the sheep are persuaded to acquiesce whenever they point at the familiar boogey men: paedophiles, terrorists, drug dealers, etc.<p>I am quite optimistic though about the development of mesh networks such as <a href="http://project-byzantium.org" rel="nofollow">http://project-byzantium.org</a><p>Of course it will only take one state to declare it illegal, and there will be plenty of cowardly fools urging each other NEVER to use it, because it's just too DANGEROUS, and anyway, TERRORISTS find it useful for pursuing their nefarious and immoral activities.<p>I will keep on ignoring them.
raikia将近 13 年前
wow