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Controlling Positive Feedback Loops in Online Communities

22 点作者 dsirijus将近 13 年前

6 条评论

JumpCrisscross将近 13 年前
Assuming the conclusion is true, this has interesting implications for our highly connected political media environment, which suffers from similar positive feedback loops with a preference shown to cheaply produced vitriol over informed debate.<p>I'm not suggesting we censor, in fact I take this articulation as a reason to be sceptical of the author's conclusion, but any policy for managing a medium-sized discussion-oriented community should be at least in part scalable to the national stage.
lutusp将近 13 年前
It would help if the author actually understood what "positive feedback loop" means in engineering. It's not what he thinks, and social-science terms like "positive feedback" don't translate well in the more rigorous sciences.<p>In strict engineering terms, feedback loops must always have a gain less than unity, and a stable, reliable system normally has negative net feedback. But this doesn't sound "right" to a social scientist, who understands these terms in an entirely different way.
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ChrisNorstrom将近 13 年前
I agreed with him up until his solution. Because "controlling input" is also unsustainable when a community grows. Who is going to control input? If you're talking about HN, even Paul Graham tried to control input and it's not working. Or maybe he's not doing it enough.<p>Listen to the Mixergy.com interview with Paul Graham. At exactly 49:40 Paul says, "[hacker news] was originally called startup news but after 6 months we changed it to hacker news cause we got sick of reading about nothing but startup stuff." And yet here we are again, HN is nothing but startup news, I just gave up and joined in, no use swimming against the current. The sad part was that HN was originally a much better nursery to startups because all startups begin their life as a project, a hack, a mod, a solution. HN was all about code back then, which put off a lot of people who couldn't code (myself included) and slowly it turned into more startup news to allow for a larger audience.<p>The question is which came first?<p>Was it necessarily a bad thing?<p>How can PG / Should PG force the community back into more of a hacker culture than a startup culture?<p>I came up with an idea to control who the members of a community are by means of crowd-sourcing (<a href="http://www.chrisnorstrom.com/2011/02/invention-creating-and-maintaining-exclusive-communities-through-crowdsourcing/" rel="nofollow">http://www.chrisnorstrom.com/2011/02/invention-creating-and-...</a>) but still, how can one control the hive-mind of the community to prevent it from wandering away from its original intent? We've seen what happens when one doesn't control the community. Maybe its time to play secret-dictator?
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buro9将近 13 年前
I agree with most of this.<p>In fact I agree so strongly that having witnessed the rise and fall of many a community I've run or been a member of that I think that there is a natural lifecycle of a community.<p>I also believe that whilst you can artificially lengthen the life by controlling inputs, you can also kill a community by the very same methods... possible to do but very difficult in the long term.<p>Instead of trying to control the inputs (censor, dictate), I'm embracing the side effects of a lack of censorship... a shorter life span perhaps, but a community that burns brighter during it's life.<p>Effectively what this means is that I'm building community software that has at the very heart of it the notion that a community will die, and that a successful community will schism during the death phase as members attempt to preserve the bits they love.<p>The idea being that communities rip themselves apart, and that at some point HN will do so too. And when it does it won't be replaced by a single "new HN", but instead by many smaller communities each serving a niche that existed within the larger.<p>Even though those niches appear smaller than the thing they emerged from, they are likely to be larger in volume (active users, posts per day, upvotes) than HN itself was before it.<p>As a metaphor for this, think of a kind of community cellular division: the splitting of a community into smaller microcosms that will eventually grow and then split themselves.<p>In some ways you could argue that StackOverflow actually did this preserving the dictatorship through the Stack Exchange network. Except, I don't really accept that a dictatorship can know when a specific community needs to sub-divide itself to survive. I think that comes from within the community.<p>In the software I'm creating, the very tools to gradually manage the creation of new microcosms is given to the users... in much the way that users can create subreddits and that helps reddit to grow.
webwanderings将近 13 年前
What this article is identifying as a problem is actually not a problem but a chaos. Chaos in the community is not a problem in itself but rather a next stage of dialog. You have to cultivate and live through the chaos in order to get to the next level, which is understanding. By censoring, you are pulling your community into a wrong and aimless direction.<p>The bells and whistles like flags, up/down votes, are just distraction between the authentic dialog/substantive community and aimless/useless chatter.
davedx将近 13 年前
"You need to be a nazi", that's quite a conclusion to make. Any evidence of this actually working?
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