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Everything I know about design I learned playing Starcraft

130 点作者 asuth大约 12 年前

20 条评论

noname123大约 12 年前
Starcraft is important but IMO it's not about APM. But build order, at start of each game, there's a series of steps you need to do like the optimum workers to build, to mine Vespene gas; at which time to send workers to build expansion base, build marines/zerg's etc. And adjusting your strategy depending on map, other races on map and opponent style.<p>Translated roughly to non-player's words, playing Starcraft is not about winning but about optimizing your action and reaction to the quickest and most efficient. I don't wake up everyday thinking that the project is going to give me a hard time, I already have a builder order to efficiently tackle the problem, e.g., lower expectations for stakeholders early on, debugging the code step-by-step to get a handle, browse reddit for diversions etc.<p>I will not get frustrated if I can't win against CPU or debug the code, because winning is outside of my control depending on the skill of my opponents, allies and luck etc; I will only evaluate myself on how much I optimized on my build order. And if my build order sucks, I watch my replays and search online for a better one.<p>It's only I have my build-order deeply ingraned in my mind, that I work on my APM; so I can act/react faster and it comes second nature like driving but doing it faster. The same thing IMO applies to poker, trading and sports. You can't focus on binary outcome of winning or losing because so much variables are outside of your control; it's about focusing on your build order. You are willing to lose the right way over the temptation of winning the wrong way.<p>A much better expression of this: <a href="http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=142131" rel="nofollow">http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=142...</a>
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hkmurakami大约 12 年前
<i>&#62;In Starcraft, nearly everything has a keyboard shortcut, and can be accessed in milliseconds. Professional players have average APM's of around 300. During intense battles, with their careers on the line, they can get up to 500 or 600. That's almost 10 separate moves per second!</i><p>EAPM (Effective APM) is more pertinent than raw APM. APM arguments have raged on for more than a decade (since Broodware at the very least), and there have been many top players with low apm (300 vs 100).<p>For HNers, an appropriate analogy would be typing speed for coding. We have ongoing (pointless) arguments about the importance of typing speed for programmers. Whatever one's opinion/preference for this subject may be, we've seen plenty of programmers be successful with high typing speeds but many mistypes, and other with relatively low typing speeds but very accurate. There's a pretty wide range in which one can be successful.<p><i>&#62;The Starcraft equivalent of a boilerplate template is a build order, which informs which buildings to construct in the beginning of the game.</i><p>Build orders need to be informed by the map choice and opponent. I think similar considerations would apply in the template selection in photoshop as well, though not covered in OP. I wonder what the equivalent of such meta considerations would be in design.<p><i>&#62;Rush / Macro</i><p>Is this the common terminology in SC2 these days? It's strange since the standard counterpoint to "Macro" (economy and production) has been "Micro" (unit control).
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tammer大约 12 年前
Funny. The title gave me the expectation of something I've been thinking about a lot lately, which is in fact the inverse of the article's content.<p>Mobile apps are video games. The moment someone (apple) designed an app-centric fullscreen OS, the stage was set for the generation of UIs that can become as immersive as good adventure games.<p>Mailbox is the example that sticks out in my mind currently. Can't really get much more boring than e-mail, but they figured out how to gamify it in a way that mimics the internal consistency of a cult classic title. The 'tutorial' mode of this and other apps gives me a phantom pavlovian feeling of opening the shrink-wrap on old cereal-box-sized CD-ROM packaging.<p>I think the if we look to video games for inspiration we can produce even more engaging environments in applications designed for productive use. Upon reading the article it looks like games have lessons for designers on both sides of the equation: the design itself, and the design process.
ricardobeat大约 12 年前
Design work is dotted with long periods of thinking and exploring. You only need a high APM rate because photoshop terribly sucks for anything other than manipulating bitmaps, you can do things much faster in an object-based editor like Fireworks. If only Adobe would make it 100% compatible with PSDs and actually mantain it, it would completely take over web design.
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tomkin大约 12 年前
I hate to be that guy, but this is a real poor comparison. First, who uses guides anymore outside of print? 1140 Grid or 960 does the job perfectly fine and prepares your design for responsive.<p>You can write an article about Starcraft if you love Starcraft, but juxtaposing against Photoshop workflow is disingenuous at best, misleading and confusing at the worst.<p>Photoshop isn't perfect, but it knocks Fireworks' socks off in every aspect: automation, formats, shortcuts, UI, precision, etc.
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mgillett大约 12 年前
Only tangentially related to the article, but I have to commend this guy on his design chops. The new Quizlet site is fantastic. Great job Anand!
baak大约 12 年前
I used to hear this argument from WoW players a lot.<p>"It's skills you use in every business management, so it's just like work!"<p>Go ahead and list it on your resume if you believe it.
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theory11大约 12 年前
I just wanted to say that Anand Sharma is a gentleman and a scholar. And a phenomenal designer! Anand is responsible for much of the design of our site (<a href="http://theory11.com" rel="nofollow">http://theory11.com</a>). Unbelievably talented.
Skoofoo大约 12 年前
I'm surprised nobody has mentioned this yet: Photoshop is <i>not</i> design.
vacri大约 12 年前
The title should be "How to shoehorn a simile".<p>Using photoshop is like carrying water with a bucket. You've got to decide 'rush' or 'macro'. Maybe it's not important that you get all that water to the destination and losing slop over the side in a poorer quality carry is fine. Other times you'll need that bucket to arrive dry with a higher quality carry - you might be carrying over carpet, for example.<p>Before you start your carry you go through the starting steps to ensure a clean, empty bucket - checking that there's no holes, that the handle isn't loose or broken, that it's clean and doesn't contain anything from a different carry.<p>A good water bucket carrier has higher APM than a poor carrier, knowing how best to manipulate the bucket in the well and developing appropriate muscles for filling and carrying. The best water carriers can carry a bucket in each hand!<p>There is no best bucket - pick one to suit the task at hand. Wood is heavier, but more beautiful, a relic of a bygone era, and is the preferable material for use in specialised cases like saunas. Metal is sturdy and less prone to failure - easier to fill than a plastic if you're using a deep well as it won't float as easily. Plastic is light, cheap, and plentiful, which may be all you need, plus it is more flexible.<p>And of course, carrying water is a task best suited for collaboration. You get to socialise, and it goes faster if everyone pitches in.
chanind大约 12 年前
I especially like the APM analogy. The best designers I know make using photoshop/illustrator look like playing a piano
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vickytnz大约 12 年前
Hmm, this is basically pointing out that power users take the time to learn the craft and make shortcuts. I learned all this stuff not because of Starcraft but because mousing around a 21" screen (which was amazing back in 2007) started giving me RSI.<p>Funnily enough, a lot of designers tend not to bother with the shortcut stuff, arguably as they don't tend to be doing it day-in day-out.<p>On the other hand, an illustrator colleague knows all the shortcuts as well as I do (related: the one peeve I had with the near-future tech of Charlie Brooker's 'Be Right Back' ep of Black Mirror was this exact scenario, where an illustrator is using a highly gestural interface to do work. Her whole arms would be aching after just a few hours!)
d0m大约 12 年前
I also believe there are so many things I've learned in starcraft that help me in my startups. In no particular orders:<p>- Taking calculated risks - Understanding Macro vs Micro - Timing vs Economy vs Technology - Opponent psychology - Focus / Intelligence / Hard work
alberich大约 12 年前
Isn't the title a bit imprecise? It seems the article is about leveraging things you learn playing starcraft to better use some software tools, not how starcraft gives you lessons about good design.
chencha大约 12 年前
This guy didn't learn anything playing Starcraft. He learned design, and then wrote an article drawing similarities between Starcraft and design. Still entertaining.
mikeprasad大约 12 年前
Very awesome analogies to process and approach to design. I wonder though, at what point does the "build order" approach break down? At some point you need to evolve/differentiate in design. I wonder if there's a repeatable process/approach to drive that progression?
kkrewink大约 12 年前
Relating skill to Starcraft's ranking system was a nice analogy–it's easy to visualize/see in practice on a site like Dribbble along with the described improvement over time. Conversely, it's also easy to pick up on some designers constantly playing the same card.
thelucky41大约 12 年前
Playing Starcraft is an excellent analogy to playing the piano while also playing chess. I won't speak for designers and Photoshop, but for general computer usage, both strategic thinking and expressive hand-eye coordination are particularly useful skills.
vanderZwan大约 12 年前
There's an unusually high number of commenters on that website who have never heard of let alone played Starcraft.
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shocks大约 12 年前
Can someone tell me why some of the players keycaps are missing in the APM video?
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