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Observations From a Tipless Restaurant, Part 5: Sex, Power and Tips

90 点作者 merrick将近 12 年前

12 条评论

Jun8将近 12 年前
This is a very interesting but dangerous post: It&#x27;s interesting because obviously the author has put a lot of thought into the topic and has done <i>some</i> research. However, for me, it clearly shows the danger of ideology, in fact it&#x27;s a great example of it. &quot;To be ideological is to preconceive reality.&quot; and we have a good example of that here: The author has strong opinions about sexuality and our approaches to it, there&#x27;s nothing wrong with this, it&#x27;s a prior. But then he starts using bits of &quot;proofs&quot;, examples from music and literature, and the tipping experiment to bolster these claims.<p>Take the claim &quot;The meme of sleeping with our waitress is important to Americans.&quot; This may or may not be true (why Americans are singled out is an interesting questions). He then cites a song, a <i>sex and the City</i> episode and a bartender&#x27;s essay to back this up.<p>The later part of the post is devoted to an analysis of how our monogamous human sexuality evolved, based on text lifted off from a single book. And towards the end he switches to the notion of the waitress as a &quot;sexual worker&quot;.<p>Now for the interesting part. Although his non-tipping restaurant experiment did NOT provide any proof for his theory he still views it as if it did on hypothetical grounds.<p>For a much better treatment of some of these ideas, consider: <a href="http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/human_evolution/2012/10/are_humans_monogamous_or_polygamous_the_evolution_of_human_mating_strategies_.html" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.slate.com&#x2F;articles&#x2F;health_and_science&#x2F;human_evolu...</a>
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Fuzzwah将近 12 年前
I enjoyed the discussion here on HN regarding the 2nd article in this series:<p><a href="https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6126926" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=6126926</a><p>This time around the early comments all seem to be negative.<p>I&#x27;ve now read the 5 published articles and have been really impressed with the this guy&#x27;s insights. They have greatly aligned with what I&#x27;ve noticed, as someone who was born and raised in a non-tipping culture (I&#x27;m Australian) and who has come to live in the US two years ago (at the age of 34).<p>Back in Australia I had tipped in restaurants on occasion, to reward amazing service, excellent dining experiences and to be honest as a form of flirtation.<p>Coming to the US where you &quot;have&quot; to tip I noticed a real difference in the experience. Overly attentive servers, forced friendliness, expectations from both sides.... just different.<p>Trying to explain these things to my American friends was difficult. But I think these articles have really summed it up well.
merrick将近 12 年前
I found the series of articles as a whole to be an enlightening account from the perspective of a restaurateur who tried new things in San Diego.<p>This was Part of 5 of a series that begins here:<p><a href="http://jayporter.com/dispatches/observations-from-a-tipless-restaurant-part-1-overview/" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;jayporter.com&#x2F;dispatches&#x2F;observations-from-a-tipless-...</a><p>Prior to this aside from being a patron of restaurants my only knowledge of the restaurant biz was based on Setting the Table which Fred Wilson blogged about here:<p><a href="http://avc.blogs.com/a_vc/2007/01/setting_the_tab.html" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;avc.blogs.com&#x2F;a_vc&#x2F;2007&#x2F;01&#x2F;setting_the_tab.html</a>
jongraehl将近 12 年前
This reminds me of an Amtrak ride along the CA coast, where the 50yo man next to me enjoyed sparring w&#x2F; the young female stewardess&#x2F;whatever over the course of several hours, until the climax: he offered to take her into a bathroom and put her on a diaper changing table. I don&#x27;t believe she was thrilled to hear the proposal.<p>There are men like that. So what? Long-winded article w&#x2F; poor quality of evidence and thinking.
jpollock将近 12 年前
In New Zealand, there is typically no tipping (it reflects excellent service, instead of expected), it&#x27;s already built into the price - not even listed as a fixed service charge percentage.<p>Perhaps the complaints have more to do with seeing something listed on the bill that you didn&#x27;t order. If it was removed entirely instead of being presented as a tax, that might change the response.
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crazygringo将近 12 年前
&gt; <i>I’m proposing that tipping allows us to assign women a role where any sexuality they display can be attributed not to their desires but instead to their greed for money. In doing so, we both dehumanize and desexualize women, in large numbers.</i><p>Sorry, but as merely a &quot;guy&#x27;s opinion&quot;, this is pretty worthless. Maybe if he brought in some quotes from actual women working as waitresses, it would be more convincing and he could make a case.<p>But it&#x27;s just far, far too simplistic. Maybe some guys look at waitresses that way... but that doesn&#x27;t mean all of them do, or even a majority do. Lots of people disrespect lots of service workers, period. And why stop with women? What about hunky bartenders hired for their biceps or handsome faces, to attract a nice female clientele? Are they dehumanized as well?<p>This blog posts starts out with some interesting observations, but quickly veers into drawing unwarranted universal conclusions, making waaaay too many assumptions.
thoughtsimple将近 12 年前
I tip more than 20% because the server minimum wage in Massachusetts is $2.63&#x2F;hour. It is that simple. You would be surprised the number of people who think that a server is getting $8&#x2F;hour with tips added on top.<p>I&#x27;m a heterosexual male in the age range that this guy is remarking on but I tip male servers and older women the same as I tip younger women. He is stereotyping. No doubt there are some who see tipping as a sexual power trip but probably in no higher percentage than any other endeavor.
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guard-of-terra将近 12 年前
You never know where those fixed-service-percentage money go to.<p>I&#x27;ve visited quite a few 10% &quot;service&quot; restaurants and I often leave a small tip on top of that because I&#x27;m entirely not sure whether waiters see any money from that &quot;service&quot;.<p>The whole scheme is ridiculous: If you pay 18% for service, what are you paying the rest of 100% for? It doesn&#x27;t make much sense. Just name your final price.
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vinceguidry将近 12 年前
If you like this sort of analysis, try The Last Psychiatrist.<p><a href="http://thelastpsychiatrist.com" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;thelastpsychiatrist.com</a>
gambiting将近 12 年前
I still find the entire idea of tipping to be super silly. Those people are being paid to do their jobs,and you leave them tips if they do them well? Why? I understand that in the US waiters are paid less because they also get tips,but that entire system is wrong(in my personal opinion) - you are going to a restaurant, you should be paying exactly what it says in the menu, not more,not less.
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JackFr将近 12 年前
These articles are repetitive, overly wordy, patronizing, pretend-smart and filled with straw men and other logical fallacies, and finally simply not that interesting.
ratscabies将近 12 年前
My wife gets angry if I don&#x27;t tip 20%, so a place with a built in tip that is less is a bonus for me.