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I am a successful software dev but I have a serious drinking problem

334 点作者 user249大约 11 年前
I made a couple million and then lost it all, including the wife and kids. I muddle along now making enough to pay the rent. I don't want to end up like Phil Katz of pkzip fame, but I've come close. I don't know why I am posting this except as a cautionary tale -- stop drinking when you are young. Really. It doesn't get better.

66 条评论

philiphodgen大约 11 年前
There is an astonishing variety of comments here. Frankly this is not a vi vs emacs thread.<p>I wish commenters here would understand that the OP&#x27;s glide path is currently aimed at one of two outcomes: insanity or death.<p>If the OP is reading the thread (and I would guess he is not) I would implore him to ignore all of the comments except those from people who have had up-front and personal experience with the damage from alcoholism.<p>A flippant comment -- just so you can look clever on HN -- may condemn the OP to a dismal fate. Cut it out.<p>OP, seek the seemingly harder way. It will turn out to be the softer, easier way. This means a new way of living (on the one hand) or a slow painful death on the other. Let the others here on HN plait their shit. You must either change or die.<p>Disclaimer: Anecdotal personal experience sample size for this topic is &gt; 1.
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mattm大约 11 年前
I have struggled with porn at times and have done a lot of research on addictions. I also have a couple friends who are alcoholics. IMO, Gabor Mate has been the best resource I have found on understanding addictions. His theory is that addictions start in childhood due to some kind of constant, ongoing stress. It could be something like abusive parents or severe bullying. When we find something that temporarily relieves the stress, our body latches on to it and doesn&#x27;t want to let go. Personally, I&#x27;ve found that understanding addiction and the addictive cycle has helped me a lot. From meditation, I&#x27;ve also become much more aware of my body sensations and understanding the danger periods when I am getting stressed.<p>After I did a 10-day Vipassana meditation retreat, I put together <a href="https://www.programmingspiritually.com" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.programmingspiritually.com</a> to try to help other developers that face some of the same issues. Email me if you&#x27;re interested and I&#x27;ll sign you up for the course for free.
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seanccox大约 11 年前
Have you sought help? Alcohol is an addictive chemical, and if you have a dependency, you don&#x27;t have to overcome it alone.<p>If, on the other hand, you are like me an you simply drink too much, I can share how I got the situation under control.<p>First, I threw out a lot of the liquor in the house (I kept the good whiskey that I was already saving for a special occasion). Then, I stopped going out to bars as often and, to a certain extent, avoided people I typically drank with or found ways to socialize without being around alcohol. I also took up yoga in the mornings. I like yoga, but if I drink the night before, I won&#x27;t feel like waking up for it. So, I remind myself before I go out to a pub or meet friends that if I drink, I&#x27;m screwing up my routine.<p>That combination has helped, and it&#x27;s gotten me to a place where I can go out on a Saturday night, get a nice buzz going with three or four beers over several hours, without reaching that &#x27;fuck it&#x27; moment where I start doing shots and smoking cigarettes till dawn.
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mkhattab大约 11 年前
I&#x27;m an escapist. Whether it&#x27;s movies, youtube, video games, literally anything that is unproductive, I&#x27;ll spend an inordinate time doing. Luckily, I don&#x27;t drink or do any drugs, but I might as well since I&#x27;m pissing my life away. It is as if I&#x27;m stuck in neutral. However, I do make just enough money to get by.<p>The odd thing is that I can&#x27;t pinpoint why I&#x27;m this way. It wasn&#x27;t always like this. I guess reason doesn&#x27;t matter at this point.<p>Anyway, I don&#x27;t think my post adds anything useful to this discussion, but good luck.
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forgottenpaswrd大约 11 年前
Man, first thing: YOU ARE NOT ALONE.<p>You are not the first human to become addicted, nor will be the only one. There are people out there that have been in a worse situation than you and that have gone out of addictions.<p>You should find those people, meet them and get out of drinking. Over years you made a path that you have to undo. This will take years, like it took you to create it.<p>Your wife and kids did the right thing: to stop supporting your addiction. It is time for you to take steps.<p>I have studied a lot of psychology but I can&#x27;t help you because it would be like trying to explain quantum physics before learning basic math. But there is people out there that really know what steps you could take for getting out and doing great things with your life.
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zealon大约 11 年前
Test for ADD&#x2F;ADHD. Seriously.<p>Many people with ADD&#x2F;ADHD end up in the IT business. Drinking and drug problems, nicotine and caffeine addiction, high-risk behaviours and family issues are very common among ADD&#x2F;ADHD people.<p>The reason behind this: low dopamine and norepinefrine levels in the ADD&#x2F;ADHD brain. Those low levels create a very high reward threshold, so people with ADD&#x2F;ADHD tend to unconsciously seek for strong or risky stimulus.<p>HTH
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middle334大约 11 年前
Throwaway account here.<p>I was a &quot;high functioning&quot; alcoholic; 35 years in the software business, and I&#x27;ve worked for companies I know you&#x27;ve heard of, and you&#x27;ve almost certainly used my products. 15 years ago I was drinking 750ml of liquor a day. Lost a few jobs, was living in filth, and was about to be homeless.<p>Long story made short, I got into detox and then AA, changed pretty much everything in my life that wasn&#x27;t working and haven&#x27;t had a drink since. First couple years were intense, and I still go to AA meetings every week. It&#x27;s a maintenance thing. I know I can&#x27;t drink again.<p>It can get better, but you can&#x27;t do it yourself. If you&#x27;re a heavy drinker, get medical help in the first few days because withdrawal can kill you. I think you&#x27;ll find your employer amazingly helpful and supportive.<p>[I&#x27;m <i>extremely</i> skeptical of solutions that involve other substances. I guess if it works, it works, but I&#x27;m not going to get much out of talking to you about it.]
ciokan大约 11 年前
My father died of alcoholism and whatever we said to him or do wouldn&#x27;t change a thing in his mind. That&#x27;s a very strong addiction and he didn&#x27;t stop even when doctors told him he&#x27;s in terminal phase. I believe the change has to come from inside of you and you must identify where it all started and what was it&#x27;s trigger and treat that first.<p>I have nicotine issues but I stopped smoking in favor of e-cigs. Nicotine is not that bad, the cigs are killing you not nicotine itself.<p>I also find doing sport to change my mentality a lot. You start looking different, you value yourself more when your body changes and you won&#x27;t want to go back. Give it a try. Good luck to you!
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Jxnathan大约 11 年前
I&#x27;m just like you -- a developer with an addiction. But my addiction is different... and illegal. I&#x27;m not motivated unless I&#x27;m high on fake aka K2. If you haven&#x27;t heard of &#x27;fake&#x27;, it&#x27;s basically a really strong marijuana with research chemical additives.<p>Since gas stations started selling it 3 years ago, I became addicted and when they were banned from selling it I had to find more. I found it online and have been ordering it every since. I leave work early sometimes so I can go smoke it. The only downside I&#x27;ve noticed, is that I&#x27;m less sociable (in person) because of how I look when I&#x27;m high (red eyes, droopy eyelids) and it makes me tired extremely fast. Sometimes I will wake up at my computer desk wondering when I fell asleep or how long I&#x27;ve been out. I&#x27;m sure it&#x27;s probably not good on my lungs either, but I smoke cigarettes so I&#x27;m used to knowing I&#x27;m harming my body internally. I just love the way it makes me feel, almost like a reward. I use it as an award for coding something beautiful. &quot;Oh that code actually worked?! Time to smoke.&quot;<p>I hope we both find help. We need it.
terranstyler大约 11 年前
Wow, I&#x27;m impressed some of you guys share information about your personal weaknesses. AFAIK this is one of the big steps towards dealing with your problem, so congratulations already.<p>Also, FWIW, my wife is a behavioral therapist and already treated a number of addicted people. She says you learn this kind of &quot;bad&quot; behaviors if, given a problem, they are the &quot;only&quot; or &quot;most successful&quot; behaviors you know and you repeat them for a long time.<p>Treatment then is to identify<p>- why you think it&#x27;s the only behavior you know or the most appropriate<p>- what your definition of a &quot;successful behavior&quot; is<p>- what are other appropriate behaviors<p>- how to deal with situations in which your &quot;bad behavior&quot; usually occurs and how to substitute the bad by one of the good ones.<p>Disclaimer: I have no psychological background whatsoever, this is just my view on the things.
shawnee_大约 11 年前
The good news is that it&#x27;s not a hopeless cause, even though it might seem that way. I used to think that mine was.. totally genetic and thus incurable; that I was doomed to the same death-by-alcohol fate as many in my biological family, so why bother?<p>The only people who can understand are those who&#x27;ve been through it and found a way to put the brakes on. It&#x27;s worth testing out.. my test found the world a whole lot better with the brakes fully engaged at a complete stop, so that&#x27;s where I&#x27;ve been for a while now.<p>There are people out there -- young and old, men and women, wealthy and poor, god freaks and atheists alike who&#x27;ve done it. Find them, listen with an open mind and among them there will surely be someone you can relate to who can help you learn about what worked for them.
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stef25大约 11 年前
151 days ago you said you&#x27;d been clean for a year and a half - what happened?
DonGateley大约 11 年前
I have 16 years sober after ending homeless and literally in the gutter (no millions passed through my hands but it was still a lot.) I had been fighting with it for 20 years watching everything and everyone slip away as you have. This is better than that.<p>Yes, it was AA that supported me through it. No, I am not religious now and wasn&#x27;t then. I was just willing to suspend disbelief long enough to try something. I am at a loss to explain why it worked but that doesn&#x27;t matter.<p>Despite what many people think AA requires no faith or belief of any kind beyond acceptance of the fact of your situation.<p>Many read &quot;Came to believe that a power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity&quot; as a statement of belief in a spiritual solution. It is not that at all, it is merely a hypothetical that is pretty hard to deny on the face of it. Bill and Bob were really, really smart.<p>Take that hypothetical, suspend disbelief, do the recommended prayer and meditation with the caveat &quot;I don&#x27;t know if this has any real meaning but, whatever&quot; if you need that and see what happens. That&#x27;s what I did. I don&#x27;t question the mystery of my recovery I just marvel at it. You can choose your eventual spiritual path or none at all later in the game but you have to have a game left to play to do that.<p>In summary, believe nothing but try anything.
Snail_Commando大约 11 年前
I don&#x27;t know if you&#x27;ll see this, but I hope you do.<p>I&#x27;ve struggled with addiction and I&#x27;ve made decisions that I&#x27;m ashamed of and disgusted with. There was a period of my life when I was also hopeless. I thought that I had lost everything. In a sense, it was true. (Rather, I destroyed most of what I had and subsequently lost the remaining pieces.)<p>Despite all of that, it <i>does</i> get better. It took me far too long to accept that.<p>The fact that you are posting here tells me that on some level you are ready to get better. Recognition of the problem begets hope.<p>Maintaining an attitude of &quot;it doesn&#x27;t get better&quot; turns out to be a recursive function. Since lives are finite, the base case turns out to be total self-destruction.<p>At each time step, each recursive call, sustained hopelessness only begets <i>more hopelessness</i>.<p>Not only do the effects of addiction and hopelessness compound, but you get a first row seat. You watch the function expand, you see every call. You literally destroy yourself in a slow, humiliating, dangerous, and deliberate fashion.<p>A friend of mine liked to quote a man named Albert J. LaChance, he wrote: &quot;Addiction is a slow form of suicide- suicide on the installment plan.&quot;<p>Whichever metaphor you choose, one thing is clear: changing your attitude is a necessary (but not sufficient) prerequisite for recovery.<p>You are obviously intelligent, so it should go without saying, there is no avoiding the fact a chemical addiction is a uniquely difficult problem to solve. Fortunately, it is a problem that a great deal of science is expended upon. And there are many ways to receive medical treatment.<p>Tedious self-help meetings and hollow platitudes are <i>NO</i> substitute for scientifically validated medical treatment. In your case, it is essential that you have medical intervention while you detox.<p>(Self-help is very helpful to some, and it <i>does</i> have a reported effectiveness of (last I heard) 10 - 50% (surely, a study carried out with utmost statistical rigor!)<p>Self-help meetings aren&#x27;t right for me, but I will vouch for their occasional effectiveness.<p>Should you choose to follow the self-help branch of your recovery timeline, be aware that the self-help phase comes <i>after</i> the detox branch. All future recovery branches of your recovery timeline form after the <i>medical detox</i> node.)<p>You need medicine and science <i>right now</i>!<p>Alcohol withdrawal can kill late stage addicts. You wrote six months ago that you attempted a cold turkey solo-detox and experienced DTs. Those suck. They are also a sign that you need to be extra cautious in your recovery.<p>When you go to detox, go to a licensed recovery center where a doctor can monitor you. Usually this means a hospital equipped with mental health facilities. An ER will suffice if you are out of other options or are having seizures. You can also go to a rehabilitation center (with a competent medical staff)! The last option might start your detox and then segue into a 28 day (or longer) program.<p>Alcohol is perhaps the most dangerous drug to detox from. (Perhaps surprising to some, you won&#x27;t die from heroin withdrawals.)<p>You can (and should) get medical leave from your employer for treatment. I&#x27;m fairly certain it&#x27;s illegal for them to deny that. (Since you are a competent developer, I&#x27;m assuming you work at a company with benefits.)<p>If you do not have health insurance, please contact your local medicaid office.<p>Please do this. For your the mother of your child, for your kids. For the person in the future who you will come across who needs help with their addiction. But most of all, for you.<p>------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------<p>This last part is my favorite aspect of hacker news. I get to tell someone that they are wrong.<p>I used to have your attitude. I even attempted suicide. By the grace of faulty nylon, I&#x27;m still here.<p>&quot;It doesn&#x27;t get better.&quot; &lt;- That quote is factually incorrect. I&#x27;m just one instance of its disproof.<p>Now, to break Hacker News guidelines with extreme prejudice:<p>IT DOES GET BETTER. PLEASE, PLEASE SEEK MEDICAL TREATMENT. IT DOES WORK. YOU ARE WRONG. NA NA NA NA NA.<p>If you don&#x27;t post an email in your profile in the next few hours so that I can talk to you. Via email, skype, phone, whatever. I will reply to my comment with an email address so that you can contact me when you are ready to talk and&#x2F;or seek treatment.
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goatforce5大约 11 年前
Craig Ferguson did a good piece about his alcoholism, a year or two that went missing from his life, 15 years of being sober, etc.<p>It&#x27;s really good, and there might be something in it for you:<p><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZVWIELHQQY" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=7ZVWIELHQQY</a>
bobsgame大约 11 年前
I struggle with nicotine, caffeine, and porn. I take Chantix and run at the gym which in combination helps a great deal, but I still relapse now and then on the nicotine. The others I seem to have overcome completely. I had to change my life and I also found spirituality, something I had denied due to insecurity and unwillingness to accept others. I wish you luck.
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madaxe_again大约 11 年前
You&#x27;re not alone. I live in a world of perpetual insane stress, and continuously self medicate through the not-so-winning triangle of cigarettes, coffee, and weed, in quantities that&#x27;d make a mobster blush. I&#x27;ve had my fair share of victory, and I feel more than my fair share of loss, but don&#x27;t we all.<p>I&#x27;ve tried stopping my various vices, but without treating the stimulus loop, it&#x27;s nigh on impossible. When I step off the grid and go travelling for a month... I suddenly no longer feel the need for <i>any</i> of them. This is a huge relief to me, as it means I realise that this behaviour isn&#x27;t something endemic to myself, rather a habituation as a result of the feedback loop I allowed to grow.<p>Step out. Do something totally different. My promise to myself that I will do this, and soon, is the only thing keeping me remotely sane. At the very least, hit the road for a month and see somewhere new, meet someone new, and see if you&#x27;re the same person. You might be surprised.
Dale1大约 11 年前
As someone who likes a smoke (Weed &amp; Cigarettes) and is currently trying to lead a healthier life I feel your pain buddy!<p>Have you ever tried just cutting down? Even just a little bit? I don&#x27;t believe in this &quot;Just stop and never drink again&quot; rubbish I think it has to be done in baby steps.<p>Anyway, hope you&#x27;re okay and whatever you do don&#x27;t go the religion route. It&#x27;s a dangerous path to tread especially with the types who run these things.
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toerojas大约 11 年前
I think we&#x27;ve all been at a place where we feel that we&#x27;re using something a little more than we should. Please remember that addiction is a behavior. When you talk with a psychotherapist and get real professional medical help, which you absolutely should, they will help you identify the triggers that cause you to drink. Maybe you&#x27;re stressed and drinking allows you to relax. Maybe you feel overwhelmed and drinking lets you feel in control. Maybe your parents were alcoholics (mine were) and your drinking fills a void. Whatever it is, there&#x27;s a real reason for your drinking and uncovering that reason is the key to your sobriety.<p>Alcoholics Anonymous and other 12 step programs have a high drop out rate (about 50% within the first 90 days) and are not backed by science, so you should talk with an addiction medicine doctor first (and go through an appropriate detox program).<p>That said, what makes 12 step programs effective is the support community you build in them, so find some people you feel safe talking with and who you can call anytime. In fact, find as many of them as you can. You have ~200 people on HN who took the time to comment, so there&#x27;s a start.
annasaru大约 11 年前
It&#x27;s very hard to deal with such an issue all by yourself. Hope you get therapy or coaching , something to ease your burden . It can definitively get better with time. Drinking is notoriously hard to shake off because it is sanctioned in so many situations for adults. I know this sounds crazy , but maybe join a group ( Art of Living, Hare Krishna, Sai) where you are forced to be constantly surrounded by people. These are safe ways of delivering a mental jolt while being surrounded by empathetic folks.I don&#x27;t subscribe to them , but suggest use them as a tool and it&#x27;s not hard to shake them once you are cured) . OR volunteer somewhere in a group that takes your mind off. Sorry I seem to be hawking Indian spirituality - but these groups that I mentioned readily accept anyone - and make them feel at home. Am sure other ethnic communities in the USA also offer similar.. All I am saying is a mental jolt, and gentle empathetic friends and family can cure , last but not least, a qualified therapist.<p>Being part of a group will accelerate your recovery , drain your negativity and heal. Talk is cheap so I will stop here.
fsloth大约 11 年前
All my support. I lost my mother recently to alcoholism.<p>You have identified your problem. You can still recover, but get some external help!<p>You are probably aware that there is a very high risk that unless you get control of your habit you will die of it. Massive drinkers can develop memory issues - brain will develop lesions, short term memory will become poor. Not so good professionally. There are several high-risk medical complications that are likely. You might develop a liver cirrhosis. I hear this is extremely painful. You might get cancer. Also, painful.<p>Seriously, terminal alcoholism is something you really, really want to avoid. My mother spent the last month of her life psychotic in a hospital bed and before that she basically lost all control of her bowels. Reading had been one of the joys of her life but her memory became so poor that in the last years she could not really follow books (she did crosswords, though).<p>It&#x27;s just not that you feel shit for drinking, the drink will turn you into a living husk in the long term. You will probably need psychiatric as well as physical treament. Get help. Any help.
subversively大约 11 年前
As another poster mentioned, addiction is about getting away from some kind of unbearable inner pain. I&#x27;ll share mine, what I did to get deaden it, and how I finally healed it. I&#x27;m 31 now, have a wife, exciting job, close friends, and most of all, I&#x27;m happy.<p>My pain comes form severe bullying; I got beaten up literally every day as a child for three years. After that, I finally got transferred to another school, but the damage was done.<p>I used video games, porn and promiscuity to deaden the pain. That distracted me from starting a career, and I ended up living on the street for six months.<p>I tried pretty much everything to heal myself.<p>* What did not work *<p>- Religion; God did absolutely nothing to my pain away. Religious counselors were very judgmental and made me feel worse, and their advice just caused new problems. - Cults; They had interesting teachings that were partially very entertaining, but Ashtar Sharan had nothing but a Galactic shrug to offer my very real suffering (I would have been prepared to actually believe in Ashty had he actually helped me, but it was clear that he did not) - Meditation; It helped, but only temporarily. When I missed my meditation session the pain came right back, and I grew distant from the world. - Yoga; Like meditation, it did help, but it took such great lifestyle changes I just didn&#x27;t feel like me any more. I&#x27;m a child of the West, and Yoga is radically different. - Sex; obviously, sleeping around is a great distraction and can be genuinely fun, but when it&#x27;s addictive it hurts in the end and you draw other people into your drama. - Counseling; Wallowing in my pain with a guy who think everything is a fascinating freak show made things <i>much</i> worse.<p>* What worked partially<p>- Cannabis; Smoking weed actually worked better than meditation to give me temporary relief. It also made me confused when used heavily. - New Age; There is a lot of partial truth floating around, if you avoid the obvious marketing ploys. &quot;Think And Grow Rich&quot; is pretty good, and so is &quot;The Science of getting Rich&quot;. Basically, the idea is to sit down and think about stuff you want in detail. It has a similar calming effect to meditation, and can lead to actual creative problem solving. It did not, however, significantly heal my hardest pain points. But the idea of &quot;you can reach your goals&quot; kept my trying. - Pressure point tapping; EFT (Emotional Freedom Technique) is pretty good, it can stimulate and permanently remove some trauma. It has its limits though, and I felt like an neurotic idiot tapping my wrists all the time.<p>* What really worked<p>- Philosophy; Getting a genuine core philosophy and actively deciding my values gave me a lot of strength. - Openness; being extremely honest about my shortcomings with deserving people lead to a form of intimacy that makes the trauma not seem so bad any more. - &quot;Taking the pain&quot;; This is not the same as sucking it up. It is feeling like crap, and accepting that I am feeling like crap right now, without suppressing it. Practicing this takes the &quot;fear of the fear&quot; away. This is probably the real benefit of meditation when done properly, but I didn&#x27;t need to sit on a cushion to do that. - Self-acceptance; This one is the kicker. I no longer slapped my wrist for slacking on the job, or being not as nice as I could be. Paradoxically, this lead to me not slacking on the job, and being nicer. It also helped find my niche, where my shortcomings don&#x27;t matter. - Dimethyltryptamine (DMT); An illegal psychedelic drug, it has been used as indigenous medicine for centuries. This is the only way I have been able to permanently release my worst and oldest pain points. I stopped smoking spontaneously after a couple of trips, and have noticed a sharp raise in my productivity and overall wellbeing.<p>Obviously, this is just my story, but I hope that some points might help you, or someone else.
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OfferSavvy大约 11 年前
I have been sober for 6.5 years. I was a blackout drinker, and then ventured into narcotics. I thought that it all used to be fun. I did it to fit in, find acceptance, feel a part of. But at some point that changed for me. Using was no longer fun at all, it was more like work. I never felt &quot;just right&quot; but rather was always chasing the dragon. I got to that place of hopeless despair. Its a place not unlike where Dante passed in the Inferno with the sign that reads &quot;Abandon Hope all Ye who enter here&quot;. Everyday I would wake up in fear, and with guilt shame and remorse. When I wasn&#x27;t using, I was thinking about it, planning how I was going to get it next, imagining what it would be like- how it would &quot;Be Different this Time&quot;. Always the same torment and insanity. At that point, i would use to feel numb.. to not feel anything at all. I didn&#x27;t want to think about myself, or what I was doing. I wanted to just escape and not feel.<p>I turned 21 in rehab, in po-dunk Rock Creek, OH. Only after a few weeks clean, and the bitter irony of where I was in life, did I have that &quot;moment of clarity&quot; and have a little bit of willingness to accept that I was powerless over alcohol, and my life had become unmanageable. AA does not have a monopoly on recovery, but it has worked for me. We suffer from a spiritual malady, and our recovery is contingent upon a daily reprieve. &quot;what am i doing today for my recovery?&quot; I think you are posting this because you need to know, and you need to hear that everything will be ok. There is hope, I promise that you are NOT Condemned to live with active addiction. Know that you are going down a path that is not unique, so many before you, who have done worse things, and lost more things, and suffered longer have gone been in your shoes. And for them too, there is way to beat this disease. Anonymity is the greatest form of Humility. We are just people helping people, from one addict to another, I can empathize with you, I know how you feel, I have felt those pains before. Call an AA central office near where you live, send me a message if you need help
gjvc大约 11 年前
Please find a meeting near you. <a href="http://www.alcoholics-anonymous.org/" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.alcoholics-anonymous.org&#x2F;</a>
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otto12大约 11 年前
I hope it does get better for you<p>My mother died when I was in my early 20s after years of addiction to alcohol.<p>She had her ups too, which made it hard for all of us to see everything fall apart again and again.<p>Until there was no coming back.<p>No AA, family support and interventions unfortunately ever helped her long term.<p>I hope you will find some reason to quit, even if it&#x27;s just knowing that you can get your kids back - even if it takes many years.<p>It took me many years to &quot;forgive&quot; my parents (they died within 6 months of each other), realising there was no forgiving needed - they had their struggle and unfortunately failed.<p>Still saddens me that my own kids have will never know their grandparents.<p>I hope you will live to enjoy your grandchildren.
julie1大约 11 年前
Well. <a href="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14636959" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov&#x2F;pubmed&#x2F;14636959</a> <a href="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2732004/" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov&#x2F;pmc&#x2F;articles&#x2F;PMC2732004&#x2F;</a><p>The original study on nurses in Israel estimates the probability for stressed people to give in to addiction to be 150% more than average.<p>Coders are liking this culture of burn in&#x2F;burn out like junkies anyway.<p>It is clear our way of working is health hazardous. I never saw another profession more despising that much CHSCT or usual working wisdoms or health protection.<p>In my former (game company) the alcohol was even bought by the company every friday and it was poorly accepted people refuses to share a toast. And I saw the casual boozing a lot in a lot of places.<p>The average drinking in computer development and drug use {when I include the graphists designer} are way above the average of my supposed to be unsafe with all these junkies suburb. I don&#x27;t come from a favela, just one of the «banlieue» that gives nice rioting picture on CNN&#x2F;fox news every 10 years.<p>The work culture in IT is the most dangerous and irresponsible I never saw. No respect for anyone, neither workers, nor providers, nor sometimes customers.<p>It makes me sometimes feel as if I was working with psychopaths, and I did my conscription, so I met psychopaths. But soldiers made me feel more secure.
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aquarin大约 11 年前
I have become passionate tea drinker and can suggest it to anyone. I also spend time during tea drinking to meditate for a moment. Recently even perform gongfu style tea preparation.
bargl大约 11 年前
OK so I&#x27;m just going to put this link out there. I can&#x27;t do a write up like his but what he said moved me to make some changes in my life. It was a fresh perspective on how to beat some of my own failings through successful habits. Anyway. here ya go. <a href="http://www.reddit.com/r/getdisciplined/comments/1q96b5/i_just_dont_care_about_myself/cdah4af" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.reddit.com&#x2F;r&#x2F;getdisciplined&#x2F;comments&#x2F;1q96b5&#x2F;i_jus...</a>
alex_hitchins大约 11 年前
If you want to talk to a recovering alcoholic, get in touch. I&#x27;ve been dry for 9 years.
paraiuspau大约 11 年前
TL;DR - Seek counselling to drill down into the <i>causes</i> for this behaviour.<p>I had a drinking problem for 10 years, I am&#x2F;was a successful systems engineer. I think I know how you feel.. Do you maybe find that you are living a life which doesn&#x27;t belong to you? Or put another way, are you just &quot;spinning&quot;? For me, I would go on enormous binges of drink and drugs for 3 days, then abstain for 2 weeks or so. I fixed it by &quot;pressing play&quot; on my life again, which involved selling my house, and going on an adventure in another land. Ended up doing the same job, but my environment was so different, new language, culture, etc.. I stuck with counselling through this time and found a keen sense of introspection. Ultimately, I drilled down to the real problems that were manifesting the <i>symptoms</i> such as drinking, junk food, drugs, excess pr0n, etc... they were all methods to regain &quot;control&quot; over a situation I felt powerless over. Ironic, really, as with drink and drugs we actually relinquish our control.<p>Not sure if this post is going to help you, as indeed everyone&#x27;s situation is personal to them, but the common factors persist with such self-abuse situations.<p>peace.
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practicalpants大约 11 年前
This is a male outlook and take this for what you will, but I&#x27;m a programmer, and I&#x27;ve found that so much of overcoming addiction (drinking and porn, mainly), bad sleeping cycles, and raw anxiety, social or otherwise, comes form improving your sex life. For me this doesn&#x27;t mean monogamy, or at least I haven&#x27;t met a girl in some time I&#x27;m ready to be exclusive with, mainly because I&#x27;ve become aware of just how many fish there are in the sea... but rather treat yourself to a dynamic and varied sex life, with multiple women. It&#x27;s both a rush and a centering, re-energizing force. It fulfills biological needs and challenges you to be a better person. It&#x27;s not easy, i.e. it challenges you to be a better person.<p>If you&#x27;re feeling overly stressed, be real with yourself, do I have the sex life I want to have, am I missing out on some life experiences here? Be aware of how your sex life can relate to frustrations, addictive patterns, etc. because there is a real relationship, and it should not be discounted as a source of whatever problems you&#x27;re having.
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cookerware大约 11 年前
I was also a software developer, not as successful but was living in a nice flat in downtown, but I ended up getting fired a few times within the year.<p>The first time it was smoking heroin and cocaine. Lasted about 2 months. I used to do it at work too because I was addicted. Shortly after getting fired, I smoked crystal meth to get through the heroin withdrawl. This is how scary heroin is, I was addicted after the second time I picked up. With the help of a marijuana dealer, I got clean after he cut off my heroin dealer. I&#x27;d call like crazy but he would no longer sell it.<p>I still remember laying on my bed on my 25th birthday, withdrawing from heroin, thinking how seriously I fucked up. It took a few months of feeling complete apathy until I began to improve. However, I still relied on tobacco and weed to get through the hard stuff.<p>Few more months later I found another job, higher paying and less stressful. However, I began drinking this time. Half a bottle of vodka everyday after work and smoking weed before and after work. I&#x27;d come over with a hangover everyday and I eventually couldn&#x27;t keep this up for long.<p>Fast forward to now, I&#x27;m totally clean from any substance. I have absolutely zero fucking desire to repeat what has been a complete wreckage of my financial savings, losing my flat, and a waste of time.<p>What does worry me is the health effect it might have, especially the street drugs I took during this short period of time on top of the weed and alcohol. I&#x27;m alright now but I still can&#x27;t wash myself of the guilt and the regret. However, it keeps me well away from it.<p>Looking on to the future, I am willing to be successful, and I realized that I can&#x27;t do it with dependence on drugs and alcohol. I simply couldn&#x27;t allow it to get in my way.
facepalm大约 11 年前
So sorry to hear that. I hope you can still overcome it.<p>My theory is that addiction is best &quot;cured&quot; by replacing it with something better. That could be doing more satisfying things in your life, but perhaps also simply a less destructive addiction, like playing video games.<p>I think if you make it into a willpower challenge you are probably doomed to fail, in fact it might make it worse because you&#x27;ll feel like a bad person for presumably being &quot;weak&quot; (having no willpower). I think modern understanding is that for willpower challenges it is better to arrange things in such a way that the challenge becomes easy (like having no alcohol at home), rather than making it a contest of iron will.<p>I really enjoyed the books on Willpower by Kelly McGonigal and and by Roy F Baumeister. I suppose just reading such books won&#x27;t cure an addiction, but perhaps they could be of interest to you.<p>I&#x27;m sorry, it&#x27;s easy to talk since I never had a severe issue like that. But I had a lot of therapy - what always stuck most were the points when I learned to accept myself.
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hanula大约 11 年前
First of all, it&#x27;s great that you are sharing this publicly. It&#x27;s a big first step to recovery. I can&#x27;t tell you much as I&#x27;m only 31 and I enjoy alcohol, sometimes in larger doses but it&#x27;s part of my culture and local way of life.<p>I can only tell you that beating the thing called &quot;alcoholism&quot; is to decide to stop drinking. That&#x27;s it. My father after <i>many</i> years did it, one day, just like that. No one belived him. He&#x27;s over 60 now and enjoys alcohol in very normal way. My friend, also 31, quit drinking completely 3-4 years ago and he was a person who drunk <i>unbelievable</i> amounts, even to me, just crazy. Now because of health problems he&#x27;s 100% sober and he&#x27;s fine! He&#x27;s happy and can enjoy everything he was doing before.<p>So. People will tell you that it is a disease, that you are sick and you won&#x27;t be able to quit on your own.. Wrong. It&#x27;s only about you, your decision, your life. Take care and ask yourself some hard questions. Self-awareness and self-acceptance is the key.
icholboy大约 11 年前
FWIW I used these techniques to overcome tobacco addiction and stress related mental&#x2F;physical problems:<p>i) Sport, cannot be stressed enough how benefitial it is for human body any kind of regular sport activity ii) Change of current habits, which might be in turn conducting you to your current situation iii) Travel for an extended period or regularly, will effectively break your acquired habits and may open your mind to new ideas (it changes the perspective) iv) the jacobson method of progressive muscle relaxation, which can be as effective as anti-depressants and that&#x27;s no marketing talk. at least it worked for me. <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_muscle_relaxation" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Progressive_muscle_relaxation</a>
MorningInfidel大约 11 年前
I&#x27;ve found Martial Arts helpful to get myself out of my head and take the edge off the monkey energy that isn&#x27;t being released through my sedentary, code -&gt; video games -&gt; sleep lifestyle through the working week.<p>In particular, pick one that&#x27;s as close to actual combat as possible. MMA is great, but perhaps too intense. I&#x27;ve started training brazilian jiu jitsu and can&#x27;t recommend it enough. Something about fighting for your life against someone who could easily put you to sleep&#x2F;manhandle you that&#x27;s therapeutic.<p>Sam Harris blogged about it here: <a href="http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/the-pleasures-of-drowning" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.samharris.org&#x2F;blog&#x2F;item&#x2F;the-pleasures-of-drowning</a><p>I wish you all the luck in the world in getting past this.
ctdonath大约 11 年前
Lots of good options posted here, lots of good insights.<p>I&#x27;d like to see more discussion about the enzymes needed to metabolize alcohol. AFAIK, it&#x27;s very much a genetic matter: some people (or, of note, peoples) just lack the genes needed to process it in a manageable manner, tend to feel the effects with greater intensity than others, and thus find it much faster to go too far and harder to get out of that state and not go back. Those who have it can enjoy a few without further compulsions; those who don&#x27;t dare not a drop. All this, of course, is poorly expressed and based on fragments I&#x27;ve gleaned. Anyone have a better analysis, and perhaps a way to test for this genetic predisposition to alcohol tolerance or lack thereof?
yeukhon大约 11 年前
I hope you will feel better.<p>My problem is simply I can&#x27;t go to bed on time. I try many times, forcing myself to go to bed but I just can&#x27;t. I always stay up late and even when I feel sleepy I can stay awake =. I am getting tired of staying awake all the time. :(
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madamepsychosis大约 11 年前
Try Alan Carr&#x27;s &quot;Easy Way To Stop Drinking&quot;. Addiction perpetuates itself partly through false beliefs, this book goes through and debunks all of them. I used his guide to quit smoking, and it was really helpful.
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eob大约 11 年前
Hey man, hang in there.<p>Everyone in this thread has different advice from different experiences. Different things work for different people. Here&#x27;s my advice: tell your friends to hold you accountable, ask them if you can call or text them when you&#x27;re feeling vulnerable. Hell, move in with a friend if you&#x27;re currently living alone. If you don&#x27;t have anyone like that in your life, join a group like AA.<p>Humans can be solitary creatures if we let ourselves, and when solitary the world looks very different. Surround yourself with positive relationships and open yourself to them so they can help hold you up.
unholygoat大约 11 年前
Fellow code-monkey, startup founder, alcoholic here -<p>It DOES get better. Shit I burned my entire life to the ground. Incredible salary (not to mention investments&#x2F;savings), a house, fiancee, etc.. I had the whole fucking american dream and wasn&#x27;t even 25. It felt though like the next thing I knew I was waking up and I was 29, having systematically destroyed everything in my life and was living off what little was left on my last non-maxed out credit card....eventually attempted suicide but my drunken ass failed at even that! I can&#x27;t even begin to describe how un-comprehensibly demoralizing my life had become. In the absence of alcohol I&#x27;d shake uncontrollably which eventually led to auditory + visual hallucinations -- Some very scary shit! My neighbor took me to the ER one day after I stumbled down some stairs &amp; promptly went into a full seizure in the waiting room....after a few days in their detox ward the simple logic of &quot;What I had been doing wasn&#x27;t working.....Maybe I should try a different approach,&quot; I found myself on a plane headed to a rehab out in Pasadena, CA where I remembered a few friends had been to (and were living the life I wanted). The entire experience from that moment on saved my life. That first year wasn&#x27;t all peaches and cream but I quickly found my balance of life&#x2F;work&#x2F;family...got back all the relationships that mattered &amp; the work&#x2F;money eventually followed. I&#x27;ve seen the same shit happen to easily hundreds of others. Hell, I personally know a solid dozen VERY successful, well known posters&#x2F;startup hero&#x27;s on HN who are recovered alcoholics&#x2F;addicts.<p>Please shoot me an email.. even just to chat... unholygoat@gmx.com (it&#x27;s forwarded to my real email)<p>If you don&#x27;t want to email me or Snail_commando at least checkout this site (It&#x27;s a giant forum&#x2F;directory of all the many different types of help out there &amp; can put in in touch with all the various resources that are local to you).<p><a href="http://www.soberrecovery.com/" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.soberrecovery.com&#x2F;</a><p>Anyhow man, I hope to hear from you...there&#x27;s an entire world out there of people who have lived through the madness and chaos and can help you do the same. -b
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Stronico大约 11 年前
After reading a lot of the comments I think it would be useful to create a distinction between a drinking problem (loosely defined as someone drinks to much, has negative consequences, etc) and addiction (loosely define as strong, life threatening withdrawal symptoms and intense cravings).<p>I&#x27;ve heard addiction defined as a &quot;Confusion of your survival instincts&quot; caused by prolonged exposure to a drug which seems to be an adequate and accurate description of addiction.
hunvreus大约 11 年前
I believe that regular exercise and switching to a proper diet (paleo) helped me give up on alcohol altogether.<p>I&#x27;d recommend you start kicking you own butt: go to <a href="http://www.nerdfitness.com/academy-overview-page/" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.nerdfitness.com&#x2F;academy-overview-page&#x2F;</a> and subscribe, start building a routine. Stick to it and you&#x27;ll quickly see that abusive drinking isn&#x27;t just an option.
glanotte大约 11 年前
I am an alcoholic sober for 7 years. You know you have a problem and that really is great because then you can address it. If you need to talk to someone, find me on twitter @glanotte and we will find a way to get in touch.<p>If you don&#x27;t want to talk, get to an AA meeting or if you don&#x27;t think you can control yourself, check into rehab. Strike while you care about it, don&#x27;t wait for yourself to start making excuses.
Stronico大约 11 年前
You should check out the documentary &quot;Pleasure Unwoven&quot; for the psychiatric&#x2F;brain aspects of addiction <a href="http://www.amazon.com/Pleasure-Unwoven-Explanation-Disease-Addiction/dp/B003AC98V2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&amp;qid=1396013931&amp;sr=8-1&amp;keywords=pleasure+unwoven" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.amazon.com&#x2F;Pleasure-Unwoven-Explanation-Disease-A...</a>
mitko大约 11 年前
Fwiw, I&#x27;d like to share some the way I approached alcohol, after going through some times where I drank more beer than water.<p>Now, I still drink from time to time, but it is easier for me to decide not to drink in a given situation.<p><a href="http://mitko.github.io/2013/11/09/overthrowing-alcohol/" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;mitko.github.io&#x2F;2013&#x2F;11&#x2F;09&#x2F;overthrowing-alcohol&#x2F;</a>
zafka大约 11 年前
All I can tell you is that It really can get quite good after you stop drinking. Not always right away, and of course, not all the time. But I really am grateful that I am able to enjoy life as much as I do. While I regret my time as a derelict, I think I might have needed that to convince myself to stay stopped now that I have quit. ( for quite a while now)
caymaness大约 11 年前
The thing that helped me the most was to simply accept that I was not alone in my pain&#x2F;struggles. For far too long did I imagine that my pain was unique. Once I opened up to friends I found, to my surprise, that many people were going through a very similar type of strife. Accepting that you are not alone is a major first step towards recovery.
halis大约 11 年前
I&#x27;m a 32 year old software developer and I&#x27;ve been sober for over 6 years now. Had a horrible drinking problem, that got progressively worse since my teen years.<p>Today, I have a wife and two sons and I don&#x27;t miss drinking one bit. But I had to get pretty low to stop. Everyone&#x27;s bottom is different, I was lucky that I hit mine so young.
motters大约 11 年前
That&#x27;s surprising because at least in my case I discovered when I was a teenager that boozing and coding don&#x27;t mix. Even small amounts of alcohol make it hard for me to concentrate on any amount of programming, and so that is why I rarely consume it. I just like coding more than boozing.
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jesusmichael大约 11 年前
Dude... Don&#x27;t feel bad, you join the ranks of 1000&#x27;s of lottery winners, except you have skills... You&#x27;re the 1% if not in net worth... definitely in brains... Do something
patrikj大约 11 年前
Did the addiction have anything to do with the fact that you are a software developer?<p>Good advice, but I doubt that developers would be especially prone to alcoholism.
randomflavor大约 11 年前
drinking is just a symptom - real problem is between your ears. you drink to quiet it. until you find a replacement you are fucked. you can&#x27;t just &#x27;stop&#x27;. maybe for a few days or weeks or months, but the consequences of your drinking won&#x27;t really change.
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mydogmuppet大约 11 年前
If your drinking is costing you more than money its usually a problem. Alcoholism is an equal opportunity employer. Are you Willing to take action to stop drinking ? You are not alone; there are many who have similar experiences. Many of these problem drinkers made a decision that today was going to be the day that they started to save their own lives.
cnp大约 11 年前
Get through the tough, deadly part, then look into Ibogaine treatment in Mexico or Canada.
imre大约 11 年前
my 2 rules: 1) never drink alcohol alone 2) never drink alcohol to lessen hangover
spiritplumber大约 11 年前
Hang in there, bro.
epynonymous大约 11 年前
same here, i like to drink scotch
sixmonthssober大约 11 年前
I hate the fact that I cannot attach my real name or handle when writing on this topic, but that&#x27;s just the way things are right now.<p>Today is my 180th day sober. If you asked me a year ago if I&#x27;d be dead or six months sober in a year&#x27;s time, I&#x27;d have gone with dead.<p>Somehow I kept my current full time developer job through the past five years, but over the last decade have lost one job, bankrupted a company I co-founded and had my wife leave me. I offer the same advice as OP: Stop drinking now. Telling yourself you&#x27;ll stop at some arbitrary point in the future won&#x27;t work. The long term consequences are ugly; My teeth and skin are fucked up, my short term memory is cracked, and it&#x27;s only been the past six months of my adult life that I&#x27;ve not been pissing away every paycheck. But I feel a lot smarter now than I was a year ago.<p>I decided I wanted to stop, and so I did the only thing I could: I moved away from the self-destructive social scene and habits I had been wallowing in. I just up and left (luckily could work in another city).<p>But keep in mind that post-stopping is really hard. I feel so productive and sharper now that it&#x27;s ironically depressing; I know I wasted years and threw away dozens of opportunities. There are friendships where I fear I&#x27;ll never be able to repair the damage that drunk me caused, but I will try. In the past month or so I&#x27;ve finally been able to man up and contact some of them to tell them what&#x27;s happened. Some I owe money. I will fix this. Even if they still won&#x27;t forgive me.<p>Having someone to talk to and an avenue to vent is essential. Big lifestyle changes helped me, especially getting out of the environment where I could get away with drinking like that every day and working from 11 or noon still drunk.<p>Other people here have mentioned the medical ramifications of quitting. It&#x27;s no joke. I didn&#x27;t quit until I feared dying from quitting as much as I feared dying from continuing. Maybe this is the choice you have now. I hope you choose life. After all, that&#x27;s why we&#x27;re here.<p>From my experience of quitting:<p>Read up at the Crippling Alcoholism subreddit. Lots of good resources on quitting. See a doctor, get evaluated and say, &quot;I need help.&quot; If tapering helps, do it. I tapered for four days before checking in. It&#x27;s different for everyone, but I had night terrors, sweats and I heard voices. This lasted a couple of weeks. Get medication for anxiety. But don&#x27;t stay on it long. I&#x27;m back to having the occasional anxiety attack, but that&#x27;s better than puking on my laptop once a month or so. Eat better, lose weight. Focus the addictive part of your personality on fitness goals. I&#x27;ve lost 2.5 stone so far. I almost feel like a person again.<p>Message me if you want.
venomsnake大约 11 年前
There were examples in Charles Duhigg&#x27;s The Power of Habit about people that have managed to turn their life around. Probably it is worth taking a look at.<p>Also - as a person that has struggled with (thankfully) only weight - there are no silver bullets.
PreetikaThakur大约 11 年前
It&#x27;s good that you have at least realized, for the all tings you did. There&#x27;s nothing impossible if someone actually tries it. I wish you luck :) Hope you&#x27;&#x27;ll soon get what you have lost.
newblahbl4hblah大约 11 年前
Get help. Don&#x27;t put it off.
ffbellfhtlflf大约 11 年前
Kinda makes me wonder why the hell so many people are tryna tell me to slow down. Seems like motherfuckers should be shuttin&#x27; the hell up and enjoyin&#x27; the show
nitishdhar大约 11 年前
Keep calm &amp; write awesome code
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homakov大约 11 年前
That&#x27;s sad, but you are not doing drugs - you can quit easily, just do it! Try to do sports or stuff like that, travel.. Seriously, alcohol is disgusting if you drink it every day.<p>I have a hooker problem, no joke. Since we are talking about addictions here?
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seanhandley大约 11 年前
Or.... you could practice moderation?<p>Alcohol does not make you into a problem. You make yourself into a problem, and lump alcohol in with all the other things that you could blame it on.<p>Grow up. Be accountable to yourself. Don&#x27;t externalise blame.
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